What caliber would best suit my needs?

[Bill Allen]

I want to buy a new rifle for deer hunting so I figure that it would make sense to decide on a caliber first. The longest shot I have to make is about 200 hundred yards, though most shots are in the 50-150 yard range. I have been using a borrowed Savage .308 with a synthetic stock that weighs in at a hefty 11 pounds but I don't mind the weight since I usually sit in a tree stand. (I suspect that the weight is the reason that the gun has so little recoil.) I have no complaints with the .308 but I have not shot any thing else to compare it to except my brother's 7mm which just has too much recoil, for me. What caliber would best fit my style of hunting? Thanks.

[wrenchman]

the 308 is not a bad gun to shoot any way and it will do what you are looking to do.
when you get into any round frome 270 up to the 300 it is most just a personel choice the 7mm 08 is nice to.

[Jack]

If 200 yards is the longest range you'd shoot and deer are the only target, heck, you could use almost anything...
I'd start at 24 caliber, maybe 25 caliber would be better.
Like 257 Roberts, 25-06, 6.5x55, 260 Rem, 270,7x57,7mm-08, 280, 308....the list is gonna be nearly endless.
You don't need a magnum for the kind of deer hunting you're doing.

[Brithunter]

Hi There,

I will answer with another question:-

What is the easiest ammo to get where you are and hunt?

[Bill Allen]

Originally posted by Brithunter
Hi There,

I will answer with another question:-

What is the easiest ammo to get where you are and hunt?

I don't know. I live in a city of about a million people so I would assume that acquiring a good variety of ammo would not be a problem. I don't have any plans to do any reloading so I need a caliber that does have a good selection of factory ammo.

After finding this forum and extensively reading the threads I have learned that a non magnum caliber is what I probably need. I like the 25 caliber suggestion but how do I narrow my choice from there? Are there just small differences in the calibers suggested or are they all very close and one will be as good as another for a novice like myself and my hunting situation?

[jmarriott]

The new 25 WSSM looks intresting.

I would still go for the 7mm-08 as i believe it is a fine deer rifle cartridge.

[Gil Martin]

These good folks have given good advice. The range of possible caliber choices is a long one. My recommendation would be to shop the used gun racks at a few gun shops and see what appeals to you. I would stick with the more traditional calibers such as the .270 Winchester, .280 Remington,. 30-06 Springfield or the .308 Winchester. I agree that magnums may not be the best choice and the new magnums are expensive for the rifle and the ammo. It depends on what appeals to you, handles well and you can afford. All the best...
Gil

[Brithunter]

Hi There,

So where you live there should be a good selection of ammo...... good, now some one has already said check out the S/H rifles. Well I would certainly do that and as you are not hard and fast set on a cartridge you have a nice wide open field to look at. Myself I would be looking as the condition first, the rest will follow. Once you have found a likely candidate, if possible mount it as if you are going to shoot it. Now do the sights line up naturally? ....... or do you have to shift your head, even without a scope fitted if has no iron sights you should get an idea if it fits you. The fit of a rifle is more important than a lot of folks realise, it can the difference bewten a good solid hit and a miss or very poor hit should you have to moutn the rifle and fire quickly in the field.

Once you find a real nice condition rifle which feels right worry about what it's chambered for then. I would certainly steer away from the magnums though, the ammo is more costly and for what you want they just are not needed.

Oh and have fun lookinf and good luck in your quest!:D

[Bill Allen]

I hadn't thought about how the gun would fit me. Thanks for pointing that out. I guess the smart thing to do would be to hold a few of them up to my shoulder and see how they feel. I think I do want to stick with a tradition caliber. That makes sense to me.

I appreciate all of the advice that has been given. :)

[300 RUM]

If you have liked the 308 why not stay with it. Even in a lighter rifle the recoil is not bad. If you want a little less recoil the 7mm 08 or even 243 would be great choices. I have both a 243 and 308. They have the same case size just the 243 is necked down. The 7mm-08 is right in the middle between the 243 and 308.

I would stay with the 308 due to a little more "knockdown" with heavier bullets. The heaviest bullet for the 243 is 100gr. The 308 can go easily up to the 165 to 180 grain bullet which since you rarely shoot over 200 yards the bullet drop should not matter. Also there is an endless supply of inexpensive 308 ammo since it is a military caliber, great ammo for just plinking.

As for the rifle there are countless choices. The Savage is an inexpensive yet accurate rifle with the new accutrigger. You can get the heavy or light weight barrel.
Remington also has a great assortment of rifles a little more expensive than the Savage but the Remington has a history of rock solid reliability and many many after market upgrades available.

I would go to the local gun shop and try on a few, see how they fit. Then see what falls in your price range.:)

For Me, the price range thing usually makes my decision for me.:D :( :D

[PJgunner]

First off, I would definitely stay away from the magnums. For the circumstance you have described, they are not needed. While others have given good advice on the various cartridges, my choice would be the .308 Winchester hands down. The 30-06 would be my second choice and the 7mm-08 or 7x57 Mauser my third choice. That last one (7x57)is a darn good round but is underloaded by the factories. It can be souped up if you're a relaoder to what the 7mm-08 can do and go with heavier bullets to boot. A great round and I like it.
But, let's go back to the .308 and why I rated it first. One, is is just about as powerful as a 30-06 and in some cases more powerful. :confused: What did he say? Yup. I have chronogrphed several brands of ammo in both .308 and 30-06 using 180 gr. bullets and the .308 was faster. It is my thought that the liability lawyers have suggested that the factories quietly down load the good old 06 just a bit more than they used to due to the old weak guns still in use. Let's just say that one brand I tested had the .308 going almost 50 FPS faster than the 30-06 in the same brand.
My personal choice for the .308 as an all round load would be with a 165 gr. bullet. I took a fairly large Mule deer at 250 yards with a 165 gr. Speer Hot-core loaded to 2550 FPS from an 18.5" barreled carbine. (Ruger 77 RSI) The same load delivers 2610 FPS from a 22" barreled Winchester M70, for whatever that's worth.
The point is, although I could load up faster loads, this one does the job. I forget what load I used in a 20" barreled .308, but the 150 gr. bullet pushed by a hot load using H-335 took down a 250 plus pound Mule deer at 427 paces, witnessed by two hunting partners. The 150 gr. is fine for deer, but mangles too much eating meat IMHO. Most 180 gr. spitzer bullets may be a bit too tough, but they should work OK. I feel the 165 gr. bullet is an excellent compromise, and I wouldn't worry about that load on elk out to about 200 yards. :cool:
I must like the .308 quite a bit as at last count, I have seven sporting rifles and one target rifle chambered to the round. :D
One of the sporters only weighs 5 pounds, loaded, scoped and with a sling. That one only has a 19" barrel. Recoil is not as bad as you might think with that rifle, but holding it steady is a bit of something else. :rolleyes:
Look for something like a short action Winchester M70, Ruger 77, Savage 110, Remington M7 or 700 or my favorite, a Ruger 77 RSI in .308 and have fun. Every one of those rifles should do the job for you with ease, except the RSI. They can be a bit fussy about ammo, but once you find the key, they'll be good shooters too.
Paul B.

[CanWoodsman]

25 cal. is excellent for deer & in my opinion the 25.06 is best. Good out to 400 yards & generally the easiest 25 cal. ammo to find. Also good for smaller game with lighter bullets.

Good Luck on Your Choice

[earschplitinloudenboomer]

Good Savage 110 in a .30-06 would be hard to beat. If you've shot a 308, the recoil is certainly no worse, if the weight of the gun and stock design are comparable. The Savage has a long action, may as well utilize it. The .30-06 caliber is the standard everything else is measured by. I don't currently own one, but they work for the conditions you describe quite well.

[Dom]

Boy, so many good options and a lot of good info here. Kinda gonna boil down to a personal thing, but I'll give .02 cents worth:

1. If it's only ever going to be used for an average, excellent deer rifle, .270 gets my vote.

2. But, if it's going to be used for anything more stout, like black bear or big mulies or elk, I'd lean towards the venerable 30-06.

Take a 7Mag or 300 WinMag, more ooomph if it was more of an elk hunter, but at the cost of burning quite a bit more powder and recoil and not needed in a deer rifle. Waidmannsheil, Dom.

[Cal Sibley]

I think my 30 caliber days ended with the purchase of a 6.5x55.
Mine is a Remington Classic and shoots everything from 85 to 160grs., and accurately at that. it's not a heavy kicker, and you won't need to tote around a 10 lb. rifle. I don't know why it took so many years for me to latch onto a 6.5x55, just a slow learner I guess. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

[Bill Allen]

I agree. I am also getting older and don't want to be smacked around any more than is necessary so I think I want to stay south of the 30 calibers. That still leaves many good calibers that will well work for me. As someone suggested, I think I will be flexible on the caliber and see what rifle I run into that I like and make my decision from what calibers are available. I have learned a ton in this thread and appreciate all of the advice. Keep it coming. I am definitely learning from it. :)

[TheeBadOne]

Originally posted by jmarriott
I would still go for the 7mm-08 as i believe it is a fine deer rifle cartridge. http://www.huntchat.com/images/icons/icon14.gif

[.243hunter]

243, 25-06 or 270 and some target practice and you shouldn't have a problem

[BILLY D.]

I HAVE TO SECOND CAL'S RECOMMEND ON THE 6,5 SWEDE. GREAT ROUND THAT HAS HARVESTED EVERYTHING ON THE PLANET, DOESN'T BEAT YOU TO DEATH, ACCURATE AS YOU ARE AND IS FLEXIBLE. VARMINT TO ELEPHANT.

GREAT TREE STAND GUN, LIGHT AND LOW RECOIL. MINE IS MY GO TO RIFLE ANYMORE. I HAVE ALL THE BASES COVERED FROM 17'S TO 458 WIN MAG AND MY SWEDE GET USED MORE THAN ANY OF THEM. TO SAY I AM ENAMORED WOULD BE A GROSS UNDERSTATEMENT. I JUST CAN'T SAY ENOUGH GOOD THINGS ABOUT IT.

[denton]

I'm with Cal on this one. The 6.5x55 is an absolutely marvelous cartridge. Like unto it, is the 260 Rem, which is the same bullet on a 308 case. Recoil is moderate, and it is an excellent hunting round.

All that said, I don't think you will go wrong with any of the choices mentioned. If you want one rifle to do everything, the 30-06 is still hard to beat. The 270 is also excellent, but--just my opinion--the '06 is a slightly better cartridge.

You aren't going to spend a lot of time with either of those, at the range, just plinking for grins. They kick hard enough that you aren't going to enjoy shooting more than a couple of dozen rounds.

If elk and bear are off the menu, then you won't go wrong with the 308, and you can buy ammo at practically any gas station in areas frequented by hunters. Recoil is less, and you're more likely to enjoy target shooting. More time at the range, better shooting skills.

One round not mentioned yet is the 257 Roberts +P. You won't find many of those for sale.

My theory is that you should use the lightest round that will reliably and humanely dispatch the animal.

I've been researching 243 for deer and pronghorn. I bought a 243, convinced that it was adequate for prongers, but the more I read, the less convinced I become that I made a good choice. According to some experts, it's really just a little light, even for a 140 pound pronger.

With what you've said, I'd suggest that you choose something like 257 Bob, 260, 6.5x55, 7mm08, or 308, simply based on the gun you like best and can get the best deal on.

[captdavid]

I'd go with the 308 for one main reason. Milsurp ammo, It's cheap and accurate. I'm a reloader and I can't load for what I can buy it for. As for the gun, Remington Classic. capt david:D :D :D

[gspsonny03]

Denton I've been shooting a 6mm for 30 years and I don't know what experts you've been listening to, but a 243 or 6mm will kill any pronghorn on the continent. I've been on other boards that say they won't kill muledeer, which is also bunk. They will kill anything up to and including moose if you're good enough to shoot it, although I wouldn't recomend it for elk or moose. It will surely work for anything smaller than elk.

[Evan03]

243 to the all mighty 277 calibers

id pick the 2506 for light recoil, and all around shootabilty on varmints and good for longer 300-400 yrd shots on deer.

[BILLY D.]

GSPSONNY03, DID YOU EVER STOP TO PONDER THAT THOSE FOLKS WHO CRY, MOAN AND WHINE ABOUT THE .243/6MM, 90% HAVE PROBABLY NEVER TOUCHED ONE.

MOST OF THEM WERE SWALLOWED UP IN THE WEATHERBY HYPE OF THE 60'S AND THEIR WORD KEEPS BEING PASSED ON FROM GENERATION TO GENERATION. IT IS A GREAT ANTELOPE AND DEER ROUND WHEN APPLIED PROPERLY.

[gspsonny03]

I agree Billy. I have shot deer with a 30/30, 300, 243,6mm and a 270, and I have learned one thing, the only deer that I have ever had run on me after the shot had absolutely nothing to do with the gun. It was just poor shooting.

[300 RUM]

Denton,
I have seen many pronghorn fall to a .243. Two this year alone, one at 175 yards the other at 210 yards both distances measured with laser rangefinder before the shot. I will admit both of thoses were close shots for most antelope hunting. So I guess it depends on how close you think you will be able to stalk. I will admit the most common antelope gun in this area is a 25.06 which will have a greater reach than the 243.

I also saw 2 elk harvested with a .243. The first a large 6 point bull scoring 351". The first shot 245 yards the bull hunched up went about 20 yards and layed down. Second shot at 75 yards to finish. I saw a cow elk shot at 200 yards front legs collapsed and it tipped over. These were all shot with the same gun by different members of the family. They were using factory shells, Hornady Light Magnum 100gr BTSP Interlock Bullet with muzzle velocity of 3100fps. All shots actually passed thru the animal except for the bull at 245 yards which I have had my 7mag not pass thru at that distance!

Its all about proper bullet selection I have seen too many guys go out with a 243 with light bullets designed for light skinned game or even varmints and wonder why it did not penetrate the elk shoulder.
You also have to be able to put the bullet in the right spot!:D

Ask any fish and game officer and they will tell you the tiny little 22 mag has killed more deer and elk than any other caliber. Illegally of course, but the animals are still dead.

[Brithunter]

Hi All,

I personally am not fond of the .243 and although I do not own one I have used one to shoot a deer with. Despite being a heart shot the deer ran and took us over 40 minutes to find in the long dead grass under the young conifer which it dived into after the dash it made. The gamekeepers rifle whose I had borrowed has shot hundreds of Deer and Fox with this rifle so I know it performs well. I am just much happier with the 6.5mm and upwards:)

Now the 6mm Remington I find interesting for some reason, I saw a nice heavy barreled Parker-Hale in this chambering and was considering it but at the moment I can't afford it plus it means getting a variation on the licence:rolleyes:

Now as to Weatherby's:( ................... No thank you.......... no in any shaspe or form:p I am not old enough to have been influenced ny the Hype of the 60's being a toddler during the early part of them;) but to say I am not impresed by those Weatherby rifles I have seen and had the opertunity to shoot is some what of an understatement:rolleyes: For most of my shooting I do not have the need for a magnum, although I did have Ruger No1 in 300 WM and I do have a P-H 1100M in 458 WM jsut because i wanted a BIG Game rifle, I woud have prefered the 404 Jeffries but I snozed and lost that one, this was hte nearest I could get at the time to a British Big Game rifle:rolleyes:

Just because I personally don't like a make, cartridge does not mean it's no good. It's just for some reason not always explainable :rolleyes: that I don't like it. For the same reason I do not like Instant Coffee of Beer.

[Evan03]

if you cahnged the 243s name to 6mm would you then like it more:)

[Bill Allen]

Originally posted by Cal Sibley
I think my 30 caliber days ended with the purchase of a 6.5x55.
Mine is a Remington Classic and shoots everything from 85 to 160grs., and accurately at that. it's not a heavy kicker, and you won't need to tote around a 10 lb. rifle. I don't know why it took so many years for me to latch onto a 6.5x55, just a slow learner I guess. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

Cal, is there a lot of good factory ammo for the 6.5x55? I currently shoot a .308 and may stay with it because of such a good availability of ammo, reasonable recoil, etc. I don't plan to reload so that might make a difference in what caliber I ultimately decide on. I agree with Denton in that I want to use "the lightest round that will reliably and humanely dispatch the animal."

[denton]

LOL! Didn't mean to start a controversy on the 243!

Being relatively unburdened by actual experience, I'm trying to narrow my error by learning from those who have more experience. And I do appreciate the comments of all who have posted on both sides of the issue.

Undoubtedly there have been many animals humanely harvested with the 243. But, as I read the reports, here is what I find:

Everybody agrees that the 30-06 and 308 are enough gun for whitetails, mulies, and pronghorn.

Everybody agrees that the 7mm08 is plenty for deer and pronghorn.

Everybody agrees that the 6.5x55 or 260 is plenty for deer and pronghorn.

There is disagreement on whether the 243 is enough gun for deer and pronghorn. Some people love it, with good reason, and others recommend something a little stouter, also with good reason.

Most everybody agrees that the 223 is not enough gun for deer and pronghorn.

I'm too old to go get 20 years worth of data, so, to be on the conservative side, I'm leaning more toward one of my 6.5x55's for pronghorn. In a modern, strong action, with "adult" loads, it comes awfully close to the MV of the 25-06... 3075 fps with a 120 grainer.

[rem 700]

well, bill allen, i would recommend the 25-06 cartridge. it has a very small recoil, and is effective past 400 yards for deer. the ballistics are excellent. foot lbs are around 2500 and drop isn't much worse than a 22/250. the recoil is also around the range of a 22/250, and it seems to fit your needs. perfect for a wide variety of shot ranges, and has excellent accuracy. shells vary from about $15-35

[wrenchman]

One of the things i find is if you are going to have one gun and the 308 has been working stay with it you know the round and it works.
Then you can be like the rest of us and buy the ones you like and go frome there its like a pringel one is never anuf just dont try to splain it to the wife.
I have 15 long guns and 7 hand guns and still look at others and say to my self< self i would like to have one of them>
I also dont know how many guns i have owned and sold off to get others.

[Brithunter]

Hi evan03,

Changing the name of the .234 would not work, sorry. The 6mm Remington cartridge intriuges me I think due to the troubles with the early ones because of the barrel twist, also the cartridge length is basically the same as the Mauser case. However it's doubtful I will ever get on, in reality it's too close to the 6.5x55 Swedish cartridge and I already have two rifles chambered for that + another two chambered in the 6.5x54 and 6.5x53R.

The 243 Win is a strange cartridge it seems, some will shoot the 100 grn bullets very well whilst another rifle will not. The 100 grn Bullet is required by law for Deer Hunting in Scotland! I have shot precisely one Deer with the 243Win and that was using Federal 100 grn laods, despite a heart shot the Doe ran and it took us over 45 minutes to find the body, I have never had that experieince before only with this .243. I had to borrow a rifle that day as being the daft bugger that i am I picked up the wrong box of ammo when I left home and discovered it at the wood which is 100 miles from home :rolleyes: Ipicked up a box of 6.5x54MS with 160 grn bullets whilst the rifel was sighted in for a 120 grn load:rolleyes:

That the .243 Win can kill large game like Deer is not in question, it's the way in which it kills I am not enamoured with so I choose to use other cartridges. The firned whos rifle I borrowed has shot hundreds of animals with it over the years form Fox to a 22 stone (308 lbs) Red Stag in Austria. He is a Game keeper by pprofession so spends a lot of time in the field with the rifle. For example he has shot 16 Fallow deer this Year and about 25 Roe deer in the Cull plus a fair few Foxes.