What's wrong with Glocks?

[model 70]

I hear some of you dislike them. What are the reasons behind this?

[VinVega]

I think they're ugly. I also don't like the idea of a gun with no safety other than the trigger thing. I know it's "safety enough" to keep your finger off the trigger, but in a holster I like the extra reassurance. Don't let the metal vs. plastic thing get to you, polymer's just as strong as a lot of metals, and the frame won't rust (but the other metal parts will). Glocks are fine pistols if that's what you like. They're dependable, and well built, and lots of parts and holsters and accessories are available for them. I just wouldn't have them mostly for the fact that I think they're ugly.

[TreeDoc]

They're black.

They're evil.

I resisted for years.

Then I broke down.

I went to the dark side.

I have somewhere in the neighborhood of let's just say "20 something" handguns with 80% of those being modern day semi's like a collection of S&W Tacticals, Beretta's, 1911', etcetera. I have learned that there is no other gun that has the ergonomic characteristics of a Glock that allow you to take it out of the box and shoot it very well with the first magazine load. Your result might vary but I doubt it. I started using it competitively right away and excelled from there.

The Springfield XD's come very close to that same scenario, I have a couple of those too. The out of box trigger is better, IMO but the learning curve is a bit bigger than the Glock.

I am seriously considering chiitcanning all the others and just sticking with a series of Glunks in different calibers.

[model 70]

how do they stack up against the SIGs?

[TreeDoc]

2 very different animals.

Sig Sauer makes a fine firearm, very high quality and reliabilty. I personally don't like they way they fit. Notice the line of the bore sits way above a shooters hand, it's a tall gun. This can tend to create more muzzle flip. The Glock has a lower bore line, the handle is canted at a different angle as well (30 degrees I believe) creating a more natural pointing gun that doesn't require conscious adjustment when aiming.

I believe the Glock has undergone more rigorous testing due to its target of being an international military sidearm as well as law enforcement. I remember some of the testing was the gun was fired in water while sand was being poured into the action at the same time the gun was cycling. It keeps on going!

[Adam Helmer]

model 70,

I tend to agree with VinVega, the Glocks are ugly and a more positive safety than what we had (none) on the previously issued DA S&W revolvers would have been nice. In 1989 we got Glock 17s and 19s at the agency and I took the M19. I was the Firearms Coordinator (Instructor) for all 100 of our agents in New England. I shot my Glock 19 a lot and it was accurate and three (3) times in 7 years it quit DEAD STOP! Luckily, I was on the range when my Glock 19 died! All three times I sent it back to Smyrna, GA for refit and overhaul and it now reposes in my vault. I got a brief letter from Glock after each refit for the reasons for the "stoppage" and now carry a Colt M1911 CCW.

Adam

[Gil Martin]

I have quite a few handguns and will never own a Glock. In my view, Glocks are ugly, of blocky construction, have inadequate safety features and one cannot see the hammer. My preferences are for any 1911s or older Smith revolvers. In fact, I have a fiend's .40 Glock Model 27 upstairs for a good cleaning. Cannot wait until he picks it up. All the best...
Gil

[TreeDoc]

Yep, I said "never" once too. :rolleyes:

Glock's are evil alright! Don't turn your back on one, it'll go off when you least expect it! :eek:

:D

[VinVega]

I wouldn't go so far as to say I'd never have one, but I wouldn't pick one out of a group of guns that were all fair prices. If I got a great deal, I might give one a shot. Otherwise, not a priority to me. Maybe if I had some experience with them past just a little exposure here and there, I might like them more. I'd be more likely to pick up the XD, though, because of the grip safety. Other than that, they're strikingly similar.

[TreeDoc]

This question is posed soley out of curiousity.

So many seem so highly conscious over the Glock's lack of exterior safety. What about it, or lack thereof, freaks you out?

As you know, it requires the deliberate operation of the trigger. Dropping it, throwing it, will not cause the gun to fire. Is it the lack of safety while handling it that is an issue?

I think of a 1911 for example. If you have the gun in your hand you are actuating the grip safety feature automatically and then only have that bitty little lever on the slide that prevents what is usually a fine, light trigger pull from firing the gun.

Again, just curious as to what concerns really are?

[kt]

being a major glock fan, i have not had a response to this thread, but this isnt the first time some one mentioned the safety to me. It seems people are freaked out by not have a little lever to push down that shows a red button that means the gun is off safe or something like that. Me I want a gun that when i need it up in a hurry is ready ASAP. The glock trigger is perectly safe, if you arent shooting then your finger shouldnt be inside the trigger guard any how. i cant see how the safety mechanism of a glock still gets a bad rap given the numbers of cops, soldiers and CCW's that carry them daily. Keep your finger out of the trigger gaurd and we can all be happy. springfield with their XD series had a great idea because they are getting a fair amount of business from people who like glocks but feel a lack of safety.
kt

[VinVega]

TD -
To me it's just peace at mind. Like I said initially, I know it should be safety enough to keep your finger off the trigger, but I just don't feel too comfortable myself with it. Glocks are good guns, don't get me wrong. There's a reason they're so popular, they're just not my personal favorites. I can see why people trust them so much, though.
The safety issue really isn't anything more real than the slide realease thing people seem to think a criminal can do to a Beretta, or grabbing the cylinder on a revolver, or releasing the mag on a Hi-Power. It's never REALLY going to pose a problem, but sometimes it just makes people uneasy.
I'm really getting off topic here I think...

[teal325]

I have shot Glocks and the various 1911 pistols. I am by no means a pistol shooter or a pistol nut but for me the 1911 fills my hand perfectly and was a ton easier to shoot accurately.

I can shoot a Glock to a very acceptable level of accuracy (scored 248 out of 250 on the TX CCW course of fire having never shot a 9mm or a Glock before in my life - was a loaner gun).

For me I like the 1911, it fits my hand, easy to shoot acurately, and they are neat, ie easily personalized.

I would own a Glock but prob not as my primary CCW.

My personal beef:

1. Doesn't fit my hand all that well.

2. Can not seem to shoot it as well as a 1911. (that may just take time)

3. Lack of the external safety - Sure I know how it works but what if my wife picks it up and isn't familiar? We all like to think that type of stuff never could or doesn't happen but it DOES and the person it happens to always says "... I can't believe I did that..."

[Adam Helmer]

TreeDoc,

I would like to see a thumb safety on the Glocks like on the Colt M1911; if you do not want to use it, ok, just fire the Glock by using the "trigger safety' as it already is. I have known agents to shoot a DA revolver in their holsters on the 7-yard timed fire PPC course. Yes, they did not keep their fingers off the trigger until they cleared leather. These were folks who qualified twice a year and were not listening to instructions before they went to the line.

With the Glock 17 and 19 we had two accidental discharges, one person holstered up with finger on the Glock trigger and just missed their right foot. Another person fired their Glock in the holster at the start of the 12 round, 30 second 7-yard stage and clipped their right butt cheek. A thumb safety would "cover" those less than well conditioned handgun shooters and cover savvy guys in gravest extreme. If a shooter chose not to use the thumb safety, then that is their call, but right now it is not an option. It is like seatbelts in your car, use them if you desire.

Adam

[kt]

thought i'd pass this along, more on subject since last time i posted it
http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=351832

[Gil Martin]

It is a personal preference thing. Never said they were evil or dangerous. I just don't like Glocks. If someone else is attracted to Glocks, that's just fine with me. All the best...
Gil

[skeet]

GROCKS are UGRY!! and plastic and terrible triggers and no safety and UGRY. Even ugryer than a Ruger semi auto 9MM:eek:

[TreeDoc]

I draw the line there, skeet!!! :mad:

Nothing, I mean NOTHING is uglier than a Ruger Semi Auto!! :D

[Builder45]

The safety switch on any firearm is between your ears. Personally I chose the USP over the Glock. The magazines are hard as heck to get but the USP just felt better to me compared to the 22 or the 23

[Adam Helmer]

Builder45,

That is a cute cliche, "The safety switch on any firearm is between your ears." If you are speaking for yourself, then that is fine. What happens when you have 100 agents who are on the range only twice a year and most are NOT gun oriented?

The only nation I ever knew about that omitted a safety on their issue rifles was France. I have yet to get a good explanation why they went that route.

If you are ever present when a group of armed folks have a job to do, you will appreciate the "Load and Lock" drill and forget the "between the ears" cliche. NOT all agents are gun oriented.

Adam

[skeet]

Well TD...Ya might just be right about that Ruger thing. They do be ugry. I have one and every time I look at it I gag. It's about like having a gag Browning gag in my hands. Hey, I have 4 Browning O/U for sale. The XS models in all four gauges 12 20 28 and 410. All have screw chokes too. GAG Browning gag!! BUT I know ya like 'em TD!!

[TreeDoc]

:D Ohhh, very Ugry, GI!

I had a KP90DC. That thing was like a brick but it always functioned and shot real well. I started buying pretty guns like my S&W Tacticals, et al, and just never seemed to pull that big clunky P90 out of the safe. I was gonna keep it and mount some "Homey Sights" on it...you know, the sights that mount on the right side of the slide so you can shoot it "Homey style" but I traded it back to my dealer and bought something prettier. I'm pretty sure it's been used in a couple drive-bys by now! ;)

As for those Brownings.....ehhh....Browning, Beretta, Benelli....it's all the same in my book. If it fits and is pretty and shoots I'd buy it regardless of make. They're all good guns except for the occasional lemons that they all produce.

[Builder45]

Adam,

Believe me I know.Nathan the guy in the local gun store has a son that is a sniper in the Marines and some of the guys(not in his group) were clearing a building and, assuming you know they keep the muzzle down, in all the excitement one guy bumped the trigger delivering a three shot burst in his leg. One he should have had the safety on and two his finger shouldnt have been on the trigger. I was just making a stupid remark from A-Square's website. There is no substitute for safety and I am speaking for everybody on that one and I cant speak it enough.

Shane

[gregarat]

At first the lack of a manual safety freaked me out a bit. After I properly broke it, I like the idea of it not having a "safety".

To me, it now makes allot of sense to keep my carry piece K.I.S.S. (Keep. It. Simple. Stupid.). I try to practice with my carry pice as much as possible. Not only live fire, but allot of draw stroke, and dry fire also. After I got used to it, I didn’t mind the trigger at all.
So I am very familiar with my Glock. Not to say an accidental discharge isn’t possible, but I feel that the chance of an accidental discharge is only marginally less if you have a "safety". Like Adam said, "The safety switch on any firearm is between your ears."
That’s just my theory. I just hope I don’t ever have to test it.

I don’t mind the plastic. That just means its dishwasher safe ;) .

[PJ3]

I use the SW4006 on duty and of course it has a safety. The only time that I use it though, is when I place my sidearm in my wall locker to go home for the night or decocking when I'm on the range. When the weapon is on my hip, the safety is off. This year we are switching over to the Glock 22's. IMO they are more user friendly for people who do not shoot alot (even though they should) and can take the abuse of being in and out of the weather without being cleaned (some people don't believe in taking care of their weapons). I currently use a Glock for my team and have yet to have a malfunction with it although I still practice for the occasion.

I have a question. We all know that when you get into a high stress situation and we enter fight or flight, we loose our fine motor skills (such as accurate movement of individual fingers). If you have your safety on when the sidearm is in your holster, are you going to have the physical ability to push that safety to fire when it matters? This is why Glock makes the slide release so small because in those high stress situations, they want you to rely on using the whole hand, not just the finger. What do you guys think.
PJ3

[TreeDoc]

I agree PJ3.

Hey, I know what you mean about weapon abuse and dirt. Some time back one of my Crewman was pulled over by a California Highway Patrolman commercial enforcement officer while I was traveling down the road behind them. They carry the 4006 here in Calif also. While he was doing his check of the brakes, suspension, etc I was talking with him and noticed his sidearm. It was absolutely HAMMERED like you could never imagine because of all the crawling under trucks he does all day. He said he had to clean it every single day because of the abuse. I could personally see the Glock being a real advantage in that case.

[Nulle]

Our Dept. has the 45 cal Glock and we all like it but I guess it is what you are used to and trained with.
I started out with the 357 Smith Wheel gun and at that time I thought it was the best.

[Esox357]

Glocks are a great firearm that are simple to use, ie point and shoot, just like a DA revolver. They have proven 100% reliable for me and others I know who use them. The design is simple and well made. Though not pleasing to the eye they are combat accurate, durable, and dead reliable. Everything I value in a duty/self defense firearm!
Glocks are in use by a considerable amount of military units and police agencies worldwide. The original glock 17 9mm was used by the Austrian Army.
For the price and what you get you would be hard pressed finding a more reliable firearm. Esox357

[Slim-Zippy]

I have both a 1911 and a Glock 27. The1911 is what I learned with many years ago and is very familiar and what I carry the most. Both shoot better than I do. I would never carry a Glock without a holster. Yes Glocks are ugly and 1911 take more maintenance. If I go to the beach and think I might get wet or if I will be in a particulary active or dirty enviroment I carry the Glock. My Glock appears to be dishwasher safe, but my 1911 takes a little more effort and time to field strip it and clean.

1911 is a vestige of a time gone by that was more civil and elegant, when people acted with some sense of moral values and courtesy for each other. To me a 1911 is a well fuctioning classy neccessity that I enjoy carrying. It also reminds me to act like a citizen and be proud of my country where I can carry a defensive weapon. of course this is just my opinion of why I and others carry the 1911.