Bubba to the rescue

[TheeBadOne]

PHOENIX - An Army reservist was arrested on charges of holding seven Mexicans at gunpoint at a rest stop in southern Arizona, where civilian efforts to watch for illegal immigrants have raised fears of vigilante violence.
Sgt. Patrick Haab, 24, was apparently acting alone and not involved with the Minuteman Project, which has organized volunteers for a monthlong effort to watch for immigrants and drug smugglers along the border.

Officials said Haab used his vehicle to stop the seven men from driving away from an interstate rest stop Sunday, then ordered them to lie on the ground or be shot.

He was being held on seven counts of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon.

"Even law enforcement has to have probable cause before taking people out of their cars and telling them to lie on the ground. . . . He threatened to kill them," Sheriff Joe Arpaio said. "He did not have the right to do what he did. How did he know they were illegal aliens?"

Haab had returned from active military duty in Iraq last October and had moved to Arizona four months ago. He was being held at the Maricopa County jail and declined requests for an interview by the Arizona Republic.

Deputies said Haab ordered another driver to hold a gun on the men while he called police. The second driver left before deputies and the Border Patrol arrived, and authorities are trying to locate him.

The undocumented immigrants were being held by the Border Patrol in Yuma.

Jim Gilchrist, an organizer of the Minuteman Project, denounced Haab's alleged acts. "His weapon should have been his cell phone," he said.

The Border Patrol has said the civilian projects could interfere with its own efforts to secure the border, and the government of Mexico has said it would monitor the projects out of concern that Mexican citizens might be abused.

Arizona is considered the most vulnerable stretch of the 2,000-mile U.S.-Mexico border. Of the 1.1 million illegal immigrants caught by the Border Patrol last year, more than half crossed the border into Arizona.

http://www.tucsoncitizen.com/breaking/041305_nonminuteman_held.php
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Is this a crime, or not? (or should/shouldn't)

[GoodOlBoy]

"undocumented immigrants"

Is that anything like ILLEGAL ALIEN?

Sounds to me like the press does not want to admit he managed to stop seven more illegals. After all if they were legal then why would the boarder patrol be holding them at Yuma?

GoodOlBoy

[DaMadman]

Originally posted by GoodOlBoy
"undocumented immigrants"

Is that anything like ILLEGAL ALIEN?

Sounds to me like the press does not want to admit he managed to stop seven more illegals. After all if they were legal then why would the boarder patrol be holding them at Yuma?

GoodOlBoy

Yep Sounds to me like all the guy did was make a citizens arrest of 7 illegals

[bulletpusher]

I think we should give him our thanks for a job well done, not put him in jail for B.S. trumped up charges.

I don't know where the statement "Bubba to the rescue" comes to bare on this incident. The man was a Sargent in the United States Army, and just returned from Iraq. How does that constitute calling him Bubba.

He is a Hero, in fact and deed. He has served his country both overseas and now here. I say give him a medal.

Bulletpusher, BBRSSC #1

[fabsroman]

I have mixed feelings on this one.

Personally, I think we should build a great wall of America across the border and citizens of the United States should each take a week out of their year to patrol it.

As a son of Italian immigrants, I believe in immigration to a certain extent, but I also think that people should not be able to cross our border willie nillie. We should also screen those people that are coming in. How do we know that they are not rapists, murderers, or whatever else fleeing South America to come to the US? We should be more selective about who we take in, and whomever we take in should be documented. There is a paper trail miles long on me, so we should at least have finger prints and names of these immigrants in a database.

Now, what this guy did is pretty tough to condone because condoning it would mean that other people could stop people they "thought" were illegal aliens. Can you imagine the mess that would cause?

[multibeard]

"undocumented immigrants"

That is the politically correct way of say it.!!!!!!!!!!!

I am sorry Fabrosman. I am sure that your family were LEGAL. Not illegals.

It would be cheaper to build gun towers than to build a wall.

I really got a kick out of Vincente Fox worrying about the rights of his people being violated by the "MINUTEMEN". As far as I am concerned when you sneak into this country the only right you have is the right to be dragged back across the border.

[fabsroman]

Yes, my parents were LEGAL immigrants.

I also agree that if you are breaking the law to enter this country, you are already a criminal and we don't need you over here.

This whole thing about human rights is making me want to puke. There is a line of common decency, but on the news today I heard about how the students at American University were protesting the school's renting a site on campus to Starbucks. It seems as though there is something known as fair trade coffee, and I have no clue exactly what that means, but it has something to do with buying coffee beans from those producers that treat their employees right. Seems as though Starbucks doesn't buy many "fair trade" coffee beans and the students wanted to give the site to another lesser known company that did. However, one of the students did say that the other company's coffee didn't taste as good as Starbucks.

Whatever happened to capitalism. What really makes me sick is that these same students are probably wearing clothing made in Malayasia, Sri Lanka, and Thailand and driving cars made in Korea. How do these places treat their employees?

America is getting weak with all the political crap. Alas, I fear that America is falling victim to the same thing that lead Rome to fall apart. Politics is making the country weak. Back in the day, we killed Mexicans and took their land. I think we did the same with the French and the English. Now, we worry about their civil rights and human rights as they try to enter illegally. Pretty soon, we are going to worry about the human rights of terrorists.

I could go on and on about this, but the night is getting late and I still have work to do.

[BILLY D.]

HEY FABS

MOST LIKELY WHEN YOUR PARENTS IMMIGRATED HERE THEY WERE COGNIZANT IN ENGLISH AND HAD A SPONSOR IN AMERICA ALREADY. ALSO SOMEONE TO TEACH THEM THE ROPES. THEY ALSO TRID TO BETTER THEMSELVES RESPECTIVLY BY LEARNING THE LANGUAGE. NOT VICE VERSA. I'LL ALSO BET THEY HAD PAPERS WHEN THEY LEFT THE HOME COUNTRY.

I CAN JUST IMAGINE WHAT RESPONSE YOU OR I WOULD HAVE RECEIVED IF WE REQUESTED TO BE TAUGHT IN SCHOOL IN OUR PARENTS HOME LANGUAGE.

MY PARENTS AND GRANDPARENTS IMMIGRATED IN '37. A LITTLE RELIGOUS PROBLEM, MY MOTHERS FAMILY IS JEWISH AND MY FATHERS CATHOLIC. THANK GOD I WAS BORN IN INTERNATIONAL WATERS ON THE WAY TO THIS COUNTRY. AT LEAST THE DOCTOR DOCUMENTED I WAS. I WAS THE ONLY CITIZEN IN THE FAMILY AND DIDN'T EVEN KNOW I WAS ALIVE YET.

WHEN I WAS IN THE FIRST GRADE, '44 WE ALWAYS SAID THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE WHEN SCHOOL STARTED IN THE MORNING. THE PROPER? WAY TO RECITE THE PLEDGE WAS TO PLACE ONE HAND OVER YOUR HEART AND THE OTHER ARM WAS RAISED AND POINTED TO THE FLAG. I HAD SEEN THIS TYPE ACTION IN MOVIES FROM A FOREIGN COUNTRY, NAZI GERMANY, AND ASKED MY TEACHER, A NUN WHY IF WE WERE AT WAR WITH GERMANY DID WE SALUTE LIKE THEY DID. BY THE TIME I WAS IN THE SECOND GRADE THAT WAS NOT THE MODUS OPERENDI ANY MORE. I WOULD LIKE TO THINK A LITTLE JEWISH KID FROM CLEVELAND HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH THAT CHANGE IN POLICY. ALSO SISTER MARY RAYMOND SND. ONE DAY WE WERE OUTSIDE FOR RECESS PLAYING LIKE YOUNGINS DO AND THE WIND WAS BLOWING LIKE CRAZY. SHE TURNED AROUND TO SHOO US INSIDE AND THE WIND CAUGHT HER HABIT UNEXPCTEDLY AND BLEW IT OFF HER HEAD. SHE HAD THE MOST BEAUTIFUL RED HAIR I'D EVER SEEN. SHE WAS KNOCKDOWN DRAG OUT DEAD GORGEOUS. SHE MADE RITA HAYWORTH LOOK LIKE A SLACKER. MY FIRST CASE OF PUPPY LOVE.


I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH PEOPLE COMING TO THIS COUNTRY TO ENJOY THE FREEDOMS AND LIFE STYLE WE HAVE BESTOWED ON US. BUT PLEASE DO IT BY THE BOOK, AND DON'T EXPECT US TO LEARN THEIR LANGUAGE. THERE MAY BE ANOTHER 1836 IN THE FUTURE.

NOW THAT I'VE GROUND MY AXE, I FEEL BETTER. THANK YOU.

[Rocky Raab]

Billy, I deleted your duplicate post.

There isn't a single soul on this continent whose ancestors didn't immigrate here. Doesn't matter if it was five years ago or 50,000, we're all the children of immigrants.

Some of those aliens came here honorably and legally. Most likely they came here from Europe or Asia, and they did everything in their power to become Americans. My own father-in-law was the youngest child in his large family - and the first one to be born in the USA. He remembers being forced to enter his friends' houses by the kitchen door because he was Italian. But he worked hard enough to graduate as a lawyer from Notre Dame University.

More power to such people. And welcome.

But that sentiment does not extend to those who sneak into the country illegally to take advantage of our social programs or to send their (illicit) wages back to their own country. Even worse, to commit crimes here.

This illegal immigration plague is just like a virus infection. Let enough in and the body dies.

Stop it. Now.

[fabsroman]

Yeah, well listen to this one.

My fiance is a pharmacist and she attended some week long seminar in Orlando, FL for the American Pharmacist Association. She also happens to be an officer of that organization.

She got pretty fired up at two of the seminars. One was on financial planning and the financial planner giving the lecture was putting down CPA's and attorneys, and I happen to be both of them. After that, he started stating that if you die without a will, the state will get all your money. That definitely is not the way it works in Maryland, and I highly doubt that it is that way anywhere else. It is one of those myths. Now, the state will get your money if you die without a will and you have no surviving relatives or no surviving relatives can be located, and my fiance new this because we had already talked about it. The two ladies on each side of my fiance had to restrain her from raising her hand and kicking this guy.

The second seminar that she got fired up at was a customer service meeting. The person giving the seminar said that to better serve their customers/patients, they should try to learn Spanish. My fiance definitely raised her hand on that one and tore into the lady about the fact that they should learn English. The lady responded that my fiance was being pretty prejudicial to immigrants. That is when my fiance replied that her mother was a direct immigrant from Italy and that her father was a second generation Italian. However, her grandparents on her father's side learned English and her mother, aunts, and uncles all learned English as did her fiance's Italian immigrant parents. I think we are making it way too easy on these immigrants.

I received a Ford magazine last year that was in English and Spanish. Well, I wrote them a nasty letter about having to rethink ever buying another Ford vehicle even though I have bought 3 of their vehicles already. Haven't received a Ford magazine since.

The problem is that companies and people in general are greedy and the immigrants are the type of people that spend a lot of money. Hence, they want to be able to market their product to them. Such is life.

[fabsroman]

Rocky,

You posted while I was writing my book.

Lately, I have been in criminal court for a couple of clients, mostly small stuff, but the majority of the people there are immigrants. What burns me up even more is that they get an interpreter.

One guy was lying so blatantly to the judge that I was getting pissed. However, the judge called him out on it. It started out like this:

Judge: "Where is your attorney?"

Defendant (always through an interpreter): "He was too busy to make it today."

Judge: "Have you spoken to the Public Defender as you were instructed to do so by the Commissioner upon your release and by the Judge at your pre-trial hearing."

Defendant: "Yes, that is my attorney, but he said he was too busy today to show up for this trial."

Judge: "When did you speak to him?"

Defendant: "A while ago, but he just told me yesterday that he would be too busy today to come to this trial."

Judge: "Okay, we will pass on this case for now so that we can call down to the Public Defender's Office and see what is going on."

Defendant: "Oh no, I didn't speak to the Public Defender, I spoke to some other attorney."

Judge: "What is that attorney's name?"

Defendant: "I don't know."

Judge: "We will pass on this case right now so that plea bargains can be entered, but I suggest that you get your attorney on the phone and get him here because this will be tried after all the plea bargains are entered."

Defendant: "I don't actually have an attorney, and would like a postponement so I can get one."

Judge: "This case is going to be tried today."

GOOD JOB YOUR HONOR.

[Hawkeye6]

Hey, TBO. Looks like Sheriff Joe is the "Bubba" in this one. The Persecutor dropped the charges. Looks like a pretty clear abuse of police authority in this case. Hope Haab sues.

[TheeBadOne]

No charges for soldier who held aliens

Arizona county rules act legal citizen's arrest

The Army reservist who was jailed for holding seven illegal aliens at gunpoint until Maricopa County, Arizona, sheriff's deputies arrived will not be prosecuted as the action was determined to be a legal citizen's arrest.

County Attorney Andrew Thomas announced his decision today that Sgt. Patrick Haab did not commit a crime. He had been charged with seven counts of aggravated assault.

"This is a unique case with a very unique set of circumstances, and after a full analysis of the issues involved and the applicable law, prosecution is not appropriate," said Thomas.

Haab said he was acting in self-defense.

Arizona law conveys the legal right to make a citizen's arrest if a felony is being committed in the citizen's presence or a felony has been committed and the citizen has reasonable grounds to be believe the subject has committed it.

Thomas pointed out that one of the individuals arrested by Haab, has been charged by the U.S. Attorney's Office with engaging in human smuggling. The other six engaged in felony conduct by conspiring with the alleged "coyote."

The Mexican aliens gave differing accounts of the April 10 incident. While all seven said they were held at gunpoint and ordered facedown to the ground, their stories about what happened earlier conflict.

"They seem to be all over the place," said David Cantor, defense attorney for Haab, who is stationed Kalamazoo, Mich.

Some said Haab, who served two tours in Iraq, took the keys from the Chevy Suburban in which they were sitting, while others said another man Haab summoned took the keys.

One of the immigrants said a second man, whom authorities are still trying to find, pointed a gun Haab gave him at the group.

Haab was released from jail Thursday night on $10,000 cash bond.

Haab told authorities that he drew a pistol to stop a group of men from rushing him at an Interstate 8 rest stop. The men later were determined to be illegal aliens from Mexico.

Haab is from New Paris, Ind., and is assigned to the Army's 415th Civil Affairs Battalion from Kalamazoo, Mich. He currently lives in the Phoenix area suburb of Mesa.

Thomas pointed out that the force used to make a citizen's arrest must be reasonable under the circumstances. The illegal aliens were running and had access to a vehicle, he said. Haab's use of a firearm was determined to be in accordance with applicable Arizona law.

"This is not a green light to intimidate, threaten or detain anyone merely suspected of being in this country illegally," said Thomas. "Mere presence in the U.S. illegally is a crime, but not in itself a felony, so other factors must be present in order to justify a citizen's arrest. In this case, the other factor was the human smuggling." >

http://www.huntchat.com/newreply.php?s=&action=newreply&threadid=39576
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Originally posted by Hawkeye6
Looks like a pretty clear abuse of police authority in this case. Hope Haab sues. http://gigbitchgraphics.homestead.com/files/emoticons/confused.gif