Clip question

[Nat]

Hello Gentlemen (and ladies).

I am new to the world of semi-automatic pistols. I recently purchased a Beretta 92 FS. I have two clips with the gun. I want to load the gun for personal protection, but I don't know how long I should leave a clip loaded. Will the bullets compress the spring to the point that the clip will not feed the bullets correctly if I leave the clip loaded too long? How long do you leave your clips loaded before switching to another clip?

Thanks in advance for your responses.

Nat

[Andy L]

I dont know the "correct" answer. I was told a couple years back that you should change the mags out every month or so to keep from damaging the spring. So, now I swap out mags each month and leave one empty to "rest" the spring.

However, I had mags that had literally been loaded for years prior to that and still use them. Never had one go bad or fail to feed. So, I dont know if theres anything to it or not. Im sure it cant hurt anything and doesnt bother me to swap em out.

Seems I must get lucky alot. I seem to find something every little bit that Im doing wrong, yet its never caused me a problem. I change to do it the correct way and still dont have a problem. Maybe ignorance is bliss?

Hope that helps?

Andy

[Jack]

I don't know if anyone's ever done a test to find out the for sure answer.
My opinion is: don't worry about it.
There is lots of advice, going back in time who knows how long, about relaxing gun spring: don't leave magazines loaded, don't leave your bolt action rifle cocked when you store it, etc, etc.
I've been ignoring that advice since the mid 1960's, and I have never seen a fatigued spring yet.
I have a theory that most of the advice about springs taking a 'set' comes from Thee Olden Days. Back then, springs were made by hand, and a gunsmith tempered springs by eye-- when it was red enough, to his eye, he quenched it. If he had a good eye, and the lighting was always the same, it mostly worked. Well, mostly.
Today, springs are made in controlled conditions, and with much more even heat. The result is a much better spring, with the correct temper on the entire spring.
Anyway, that's my opinion, and worth every penny ya paid for it ;)

[Dan Morris]

I have never had a spring problem either. I just fire the carry ammo every couple of months to insure what I have is "fresh".
Dan

[GoodOlBoy]

To test this theory yesterday afternoon I took a Wilson Combat 8 round clip for my 1911 out that had been loaded in excess of a year. . . . all 8 rounds fed performed and functioned as they should. I reloaded the clip and put it back on the nightstand.

By the way for personal protection at home it really matters very little if rounds 2-200 feed correctly or not. It is round #1 that has to hit the target.

My 2 cents

GoodOlBoy

[skeet]

In the late 80's I bought a Walther P-38 that a friend had brought back from WWII. It had an extra mag that was loaded in the holster pouch for the gun. It had been loaded since at least 1945. After I acquired it I shot those rounds out of the gun and the gun ..mags and ammo all functioned just fine. The gun was not very accurate(or maybe it was me) but the mag is still being used by the fellow I sold it to. He shoots it occasionally down in Florida. He uses it for a house gun.

[Adam Helmer]

Nat,

Welcome to the Forum; I see this is only your 7th post. You came to the right place and many wiser guys than I will gladly give you answers.

I carried a Beretta 92 FS as a duty gun for 6 years as an agent before I retired. I was also the Firearms Coordinator (Instructor) for all 100 agents in the 6 New England States.

Our policy was to have all agents shoot off all rounds in their 3 duty magazines (clips) at each semi-annual qulaification on the range. I provided additional ammo for the rest of the course of fire and, after gun cleaning, new "Street" ammo for the 3 duty mags for the agents.

Bottom line: six months of being loaded never caused a failure to feed or fire. Like Jack wisely said, we have very good springs in our magazines in the 21st Century. I say, load up your magazines and at least annually shoot off the ammo in the mags and reload. Hope this helps.

Adam

[Andy L]

Will ammo go bad? Thats another one I hear some. I hope not. I have thousands of rounds stored for a couple of my rifles that I have loaded over time. Kinda saving up in case the gun grabbers win someday and make it illegal to buy ammo or all hell breaks loose, god forbid, and Im actually going to have to fight for the lives of my family. Im not overly paranoid, but thought it was a good idea. I keep loading a little more each time and seal the primers and around the edge of the bullet, label it, put it in sealed plastic boxes and store it in a dry, dark place. Is that ammo going to go bad? I hope not. I guess probably it wont all go bad, if any, and will be better than the alternative.

On the rifle de-cocking thing, that was another sin I was guilty of until pointed out to me. I always unloaded my rifles and put the safety on and put them up. I was told this was a huge sin. I was supposed to unload and pull the trigger to de-cock. I never had a problem either way.

As far as the pistol mags go, I do swap em out now. But, I dont waste my high dollar ammo I carry daily. I usually save it and shoot some cheapy ammo every couple of months to stay sharp. Or sharper. Once in a great while I will shoot the good stuff and buy a new box. But thats normally because I have seen some type of new self defense ammo I want, not because I think the ammo is bad.

This is kinda like the lots of powder thread. I still think working up a new load each time you buy a pound of powder out of a different lot is overkill. I asked a very well respected and knowlegable gun man about it and he said in public that as long as the powder is not army surplus and is a big name brand and your not running on the ragged edge of pressure disaster anyway, there is no need to worry about it. Since I fit none of the descriptions above, I think I will continue what has worked for me forever and be happy.

Sorry for the winded post but some of these wives tales get to me.

Oh, and dont believe what Adam Helmer had to say about not being an authority on this subject. Listen to him. Very few are less knowlegable, from what I have seen of him. He knows his poo. ;)

Andy

[Nat]

Thank you all for your replies. I guess I'll keep it loaded and not worry about the spring. This seems like a great place. I'll be back. Thanks again.

[Adam Helmer]

Andy L,

You are much too kind, my friend. We both try to give "a quality product" to folks who ask questions here. Just look at Nat's last post, "This seems like a great place, I will be back." Well, that is as good as it can get. Be well.

Adam

[Lycanthrope]

Keeping a spring compressed doesn't wear a spring. Cycling the spring is what wears a spring. Contantly loading and unloading is harder on springs than keeping them loaded.

Magazine designs vary, but I haven't needed to change mag springs on my competition 1911's until past the 10,000 round mark (with a buffer I don't bother changing recoil springs either until they start to ftf....which is at least 10,000 rounds).

If you changed springs say every 1-3 years most shooters would be well inside a margin of safety from my experience.

[Tall Shadow]

Originally posted by Lycanthrope
Keeping a spring compressed doesn't wear a spring. Cycling the spring is what wears a spring. Contantly loading and unloading is harder on springs than keeping them loaded.

Magazine designs vary, but I haven't needed to change mag springs on my competition 1911's until past the 10,000 round mark (with a buffer I don't bother changing recoil springs either until they start to ftf....which is at least 10,000 rounds).

If you changed springs say every 1-3 years most shooters would be well inside a margin of safety from my experience.

Ding!, Ding!, Ding! :D

We have a winner!

Loaded or unloaded, It's Not the compression of the spring that will "Kill" it.... It's the cycling, just as Lycanthrope stated that fatigues the spring(s).

Also, the item you are discribing is a Magazine, not a Clip!

A clip would be a non-enclosed holding device, like on a Garand(sp?) rifle. Sorry, the use of one for the other is a small "Pet Peeve" of mine.

Tall Shadow

[Riposte1]

I actually marked the date on a 1911 magazine and shot it 20 years later. No problems.

However the best story I heard of was from a friend who had a client who brought him a 1911 found in his fathers foot locker. It was loaded and had been in the locker since he came home from World War I (yep not II). The gun was rusty, having been neglected, but it went off and functinoed every time. The ammo was headstamped FA-18 (Frankfort Arsenal 1918) I think.

Does ammo go bad. It depends on the conditions in which it is stored. I change out our deputies' ammo every six months, but shelf life in climate controlled storage could be forever...well OK, slightly less than forever but a long time.

Riposte

[moneychanger]

hi fellow metro detroiter,moneychanger

[Gil Martin]

I saw a 1911 Colt that had a loaded magazine from WWI and at the range, it cycled and fired without a hitch. All the best...
Gil

P.S. moneychanger, I spent a lot of time around 7 Mile Road and Woodward and got pulled over one time by one of Royal Oak's finest.

[moneychanger]

nat, thanks for asking that question, i just got my first bottom
feeder,and i've got two clips loaded,just figured the magazines were as good a spot to store ammo as the box.

[Rocky Raab]

Everyone above is correct: fear not about weak springs.

What you SHOULD watch carefully is that top round. If you are in the habit of ejecting the round that's in the chamber (to clean or disable the gun) often, do NOT simply pop that round back into the magazine and drop the slide on it.

Repeatedly feeding the same round out of the magazine can and will jam the bullet deeper into the case and can cause massive pressure spikes if fired.

Some authorities say you should never feed a given round of semi-auto pistol ammo more than once due to this danger. I wouldn't go that far especially with factory ammo that's heavily crimped and often sealed to boot. But it is definitely something to beware of with handloads. I've started a practice of tossing that chamber round into a box of practice ammo after I've fed it three times, and replacing it with a shiny new round from the factory box. It can't hurt, it automatically refreshes my carry ammo and gives me practice stuff as well.