6.5x55AI project

[RUMLUVER]

Anybody have anything to say about a 6.5x55 AI? I'm having one built next spring and am looking for reloading data and or anybody that has shot one and has something to say about it.

[denton]

You probably won't like my reply, but I'm going to try to save you some effort and money:

It's a waste of time. The 6.5x55, loaded to modern pressures will do practically anything the 25-06 or 6.5-06 will do. The 65.x55, let alone the 25-06 or 6.5-06, is enough overbore that the additional case capacity will buy you practically nothing.

I have an instrumented 6.5x55, and can safely get 3050 FPS out of a 120 grain pill. That is fast enough that you have to use a premium bullet, or risk bullet overexpansion if the target animal is within 100 yards.

So, having flirted with the same idea, and having built a conventional 6.5x55, my suggestion is to skip the AI. I don't think the dance is worth the candle.

[Rapier]

The 6.5x06 has a capacity (67 grs) that you can not reach with an AI version of the 6.5x55 (standard 56 gr). The 6.5x06 will only give you 100 fps over the 6.5x55 with a 140. Max load to Max load.
Sorry,
Ed

[Cossack]

While I load 6 'cats and enjoy doing so AI ing a round only makes sense if the powder that would achieve the best performance cannot be maxed out in the parent case AND it would only take a grain or two more to do so. If you're not going to abosolutely fill the case and need more room, then AI ing makes no sense at all. Plus, in the subject cartridge a 1.5 grain increase in powder (about what can expect) will safely generate less than 180 fps in velocity, assuming the parent cartridge hits 2750. (Velocity increases at one fourth the percentage of increased powder at best. Depending on how tight the chamber/barrel is, it could actually be less than the original chambering). Hardly seems worth all the trouble and expense if the need is more speed. BUT if you want something different from the rest of the pack, and won't be disappointed with the slight increase in performance - and the resultant devaluation of your gun - then by all means go for it.

[RUMLUVER]

I'm not looking to burn up the charts with this rifle just do somthing a little different. The end result I want is a light handy rifle with a 24" tube that will come in at about 7 lbs. or so when scoped and done. As far as performance I would like to see about 3100fps give or take with a 130gr bullet probably a 130 TSX. I think this quite an obtainable goal considering Barnes states getting almost 3000fps with a standard 6.5x55 and a standard 130gr X bullet. I want a rifle like this for combing the hills here in ND for antelope during season and thought this little 6.5x55 AI would fit the bill nicely and be a little different than the rest. Thanks for the feedback guys.

[denton]

Well, it sounds like a fun project, and something in 6.5 is definitely a winner for antelope.

Barnes is just down the road from me, and a friend of a friend quit his job there because he thought their load workup procedures were flaky. They are also noted for using 26" barrels (don't you???) to inflate their velocity numbers. They made some flat, dead wrong claims about their XLC bullet muzzle velocities, and I spent a while at the range thoroughly debunking the claims.

With my strain gage instrumented 6.5x55, I can safely get 2950 FPS with a 129 grain. I'm pretty skeptical of anything much higher than that.

I'm really just trying to save you some pain. Sorry if this sounds too negative. I just don't want to see a good guy spend money on something and end up disappointed. If the 6.5x55AI is really what you want to do, it's not up to me try to rain on your parade.

My favorite gunsmith showed me a rifle he built for himself, that might spark some ideas: He had a 257 Roberts on a small ring (less steel than large ring) Mauser action, with a light, short barrel. You could do the same thing with a 6.5x55, or the 257. You'll give up your dream of 3100 FPS, but it will be very lightweight, incredibly effective, while running at the slightly lower SR pressures.

Part of the trick is to shoot Partitions. They reliably open up down to 1700 FPS, where standard bullets have to hit at 2100 FPS to open. So at a modest 2750 FPS, a 125 grain Partition will still be going 1835 FPS at 500 yards, and be 48" below the crosshairs. It's not the flattest shooting thing in the world, but it definitely makes a 500 yard pronghorn shot very possible.

[Cossack]

Rumlover
At 65 plus with a bad wing and a tendency to go further in than I should, I'm also into light carry/low recoil.
If you're looking for something light and handy, have a look at the Kimber Montana before you decide. Mine is in 7/08, weighs exactly 6.5 lbs scoped with a 1.75 to 6 Vari X III, loaded with 5, plus sling. Using Barnes 140 TSX I get an chroned 2900 out of a 22" tube.
A modified Mouser action (cartridge can be loaded directly into the chamber, unlike most Mousers), trigger like silk, McMillen stock, stainless and shoots super to boot. It ain't that 'different' but certainly meets the specs..
I also shoot a 260 in Rem 100XPR ( a long 'handgun') it gets a chroned 2750 with 120 X's and 125 Partitions.....out of a 15" barrel! That one is around 4 lbs scoped and loaded, great to carry but, unfortunatly, out of production.

[RUMLUVER]

When I look at this project I'm realy not doing this to out do a standard 6.5x55 but if I do great. I think the standard 6.5x55 does just fine but I'm looking to be just a little different. I have used Barnes TSX's before in my other rifles and found there data has been as good as other providers be it powder or bullet manufactures. I get the use of a 6.5x55AI for free and it will not cost me any more than a standard 6.5x55 to shoot since the brass is fire formed. I may shoot 129 Hornady Interlocks or mabey the 140's we'll see. I will be doing a semi custom rifle with project because I already have my model 700 receiver and trigger. Cossak I think Kimber makes a good product but I had bad experience with one of their pistols and a rifle so I won't be buying anything else from them but thanks for the tip.

[sambubba]

PO Ackley's book has data for the 6.5x55 Improved Arch which should be exactly what you are looking for. Some of the loads listed in his book for various cartridges are very hot, so you know to start lower and work up. I have two 6.5x55's and one .260AAR, which is the 257 Ackley Improved necked up to 6.5. I am still working up loads for this new rifle, but so far it is getting 3027 fps with the 120 ballistic tip and 2933 with the 129g. The 140 core locked is 2857, which should be close to the top. My 23" rifle has a very long throat, and I am not at max levels yet.
The Arch shows 3140 with the 120, 2890 with the 129 and 2908 with the 140. It has 2-3 grains less capacity than the .260AAR. My 26" bbl. Swede does 3021 with the 120g, 2966 with the 129g and 2900 with the 140g Hornady. As you can see, the difference between the standard and the improved Swede will probably be about 60 fps. in a 23" bbl.
What hasn't been mentioned is greatly reduced case trimming
and having something no one else has.

[RUMLUVER]

Thanks for the info sambubba! If you don't mind sharing your recipes I would intrested in what you have or found to work best for you. Thanks again! I realy like the idea also of having something no one else has also lack of case trimming is also a big plus.

[Jack]

P.O. Ackley was a brilliant guy, and his Handbook For Shooters and Reloaders is a classic, must have book.
That said, keep in mind P.O. collected data from the designer of a lot of wildcats, back in the days before chronographs were common. He didn't work up the loads himself.
In those days, pressure and velocity were essentially guessed at, often by folks that wanted their wildcats to sound really amazing.....
There are loads in those books that scare the daylights out of me.
And, the powders listed in those books are from the 50's and 60's, and newer powders, of course, do not appear.
Great books, but I would be very, very sceptical about loads for wildcats from there.

[Catfish]

WHAT JACK SAID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The loads in Ackley`s Book`s are all very hot at the least and very dangerious at the most. Most of the powders he has loads for have been slightly improved over the years and that makes the loads even more dangerious. I would recomand that you start with the data for the 6.5 x 55 and work up to alittle over max. for the parrent round. I would guess you`ll get about 5% more powder in at the same preasure, THAT`S A GUESS., and that would get you abt. a 2 1/2% increase in velosity.

[sambubba]

Not all of the data in Ackley's book is over the top. Some of the loads are actually mild to standard for various cartridges. That said, you have to be VERY careful with some of the data. All rifles are individuals, and loads that are smoking hot in one might be fine in another. The advice to start at 6.5x55 levels and work up is very sound, although I wouldn't start at the max load even then.
The 6.5x55 improved arch data corresponds pretty well with what several users of the 6.5/257 Roberts Ackley Improved (.260AAR) have reported to me during load sharing and correspondence. The .260AAR has a little more powder capacity than the Arch version, but the gain for the improved 6.5x55 over the standard version will probably be about 60 fps when loaded to the SAME pressures. When the chronograph shows a 60 fps gain over the max loads for the 6.5x55, it is time to stop.
The 6.5 improved rounds are lots of fun, but there is no magic in the case capacity/potential velocity relationship.

[Don Fischer]

I've got both a 6.5x55 and a 6.5x06. The 6.5x55 is a Win Mod 70 featherweight and the 6.5x06 a Rem 700. Last 6.5x55 was built on a Parker-Hale 1200 action. You'd really have to want to split hairs to argue one over the other. The only reason I can find for an improved version is the same reason I've got a 6.5x06, cause it's different and I like 6.5's.

Used to be a lot of years ago that improved cartridges were much better than they are today. Today to many people have cronograph's!