The U.S. Navy

[Tater]

Look out pirates

[jon lynn]

Now if THAT is not awsome, I don't know what is!

Anchors away!

[Adam Helmer]

Tater,

The sad fact is: The Navy is shooting far too few pirates!

Why not have a .50 Barrett and a few Garands on ALL cargo ships on the high seas? I am tired of reading about UNARMED ships being taken over by armed PIRATES. When will the world LEVEL the playing field on the high seas?

Adam

[Dan Morris]

:cool:
Dan

[Swift]

Why not have a .50 Barrett and a few Garands on ALL cargo ships on the high seas? I am tired of reading about UNARMED ships being taken over by armed PIRATES.
Adam


I don't get it either. I don't know the "laws" at sea for licensed shipping vessels. But if a bunch of skinny black dudes start conming toward ya in a dingy ya would think with even a few firearms they could be detered. :confused:

[Rapier]

Maritime laws are some of the oldest laws on the books. Every country has the right to protect its flagged vessels in international waters. We as a country have dealt with African pirates in the past and the reference to that defense is in the Marine Hymn, "To the shores of Tripoli." The proper course is escort of vessels and destruction of the pirate vessels and their ports from which they sail. A combination of vessels and aircraft would quickly end this episode. This is not hard, just reduce the ports, then reduce the small shore launch facilities, then all boats. Then quarantine the coast. Who is going to be pissed off? The Somalis? Who cares if they get pissed?

You have a weak sister as President of the United States of America and O'BS is stuffing the whole country down the toilet, trying to be just like his arch hero, Jimmy 'The Peanut Farmer" Carter, another real touchy feely moron puke, ignorant of international relations and convinced you can reason with killers that are determined to extinguish you, your wife, your children and your way of life.
Best,
Ed

[Larryjk]

I read or heard on TV that the reason ships don't defend themselves is because of their insurance. Many countries won't let an armed vessel dock and the insurance companies don't want to risk losing a ship they are responsible for if it gets into a firefight. The insurance companies are willing to take that chance because they just pass increased costs on to the insured. Apparently they don't pay the ransoms so this is cheaper. This appeasement type of bullshit will end when companies start saying and having their crews trained with small arms (including 50s) and maybe a few shoulder fired rockets.

[buckhunter]

Being and old swabbie(GMG) I can attest that those dude's on the end of the Barrett are far better than I ever was. I trained our crew how to use firearms even if they were M1's ,BAR's and 1911A1's and believe me it ain' easy. My hat is off to each and every one of the snipers.

[Larryjk]

Buckhunter, My son was a nuc' in subs and said all he ever got to shoot and qualify with was a Colt 45acp and shotguns. Said he wished the Navy would discover recoil pads and put them on the shotguns. They shot buckshot and slugs. The Marines on the subs had 9mm Berettas, M16s and a couple M60s in the locker. My son was qualified with both before he went in the Navy at 18.

[Rocky Raab]

There are several issues. First, it is true that most ports and insurance companies prohibit arms of any kind aboard ships. Countering that is the fact that if a port denies ships with arms, it is the port that goes out of business.

Second, escort ships sound good, but there are many times the number of cargo ships as Navy vessels, and convoys only work if all the ships are going from and to the same places. It would actually cost more to escort these vessels than to ransom them. (That only touches on the monetary costs, I am fully aware of the human costs, mind you.)

Third, as mentioned, ship crews know ships. They likely don't know one end of a gun from the other; arming them is pointless.

So what should be done? I have two ideas. First, ship escort might be prohibitive, but we could place small teams of trained shooters aboard ships - and remove them by helicopter or small boat just before each ship enters a port. They'd then board another ship going the other way, and be taken off again at that end.

Second, we should revisit the 19th century practice (written into law and still on the books) of letters of marque. These letters essentially charter private security companies to run anti-piracy vessels, to deal with pirates as they see fit. Ron Paul proposed this recently, along with sensible safeguards. I'm no Ron Paul fan, but this idea truly has merit.

[Adam Helmer]

Rocky,

I hear about the Insurance companies WHO WILL PAY pirates ransoms and then Jack UP the Premiums for ALL shipping companies. So we continue to have easy MONEY TO NUMB NUTS Pirates who attack UNARMED ships and ENJOY safe working conditions. I say BS! For $2 or 3 Million dollars I WILL PUT 6 ARMED MEN ABOARD EVERY SHIP. Let the Pirates come out in their little boats-nuff said.

Adam

[FIJI]

the military already spends MILLIONS on target practice. Let them start using pirate vessels for straffing and bombing practice and the lil somali-scumbags will stay landlubbers

[Rocky Raab]

The main problem is that there are thousands of small and medium craft out there: fishing boats, coastal traders, tourists and more. Only a tiny percentage are pirates - so how do you identify which is which before you roll in on your strafe run?

[Larryjk]

The UN has a "catch and release" program for pirates. They take away their AK-47s and RPGs before turning them loose. That will certainly fix their bad behavior.
My son sent me a "catch and release" cartoon when he was in the Navy. You catch the pirates and put them in a van on the launch of an aircraft carrier. Then you release them over the bow!!!!!

[Adam Helmer]

Rocky,

I would say the ones we should shoot at are the ones that refuse to pull away from a cargo ship when hailed and act in an offensive manner. The USS Cole allowed a boat to tie up along side before the suicide bomber pulled the pin-that is TOO close. No boat needs to fish within 200 yards of a cargo ship on the high seas.

Another point: Any small boats with 6, 8 or 10 dudes with RPGs and machine guns coming at you, confirmed by binoculars, are safe targets.

Adam

[DON WALKUP]

fellas...remember...common sense is not so common any longer...

we are trained to be victims, we are taught to "call the police", "tell an adult", "tell a teacher"...how can we possibly expect the decision to engage to come from good judgement, training and the will to survive when most persons are taught to rely on others for protection?

i remember standing in formation on a very hot muggy day in a faraway place when the VC were running amuck and being told "you will NOT fire unless you are fired on!"...at least two of the men in that formation were dead soon thereafter...

washington is the problem NOT the soldiers, sailors, marines and airmen...

RULES OF ENGAGEMENT: do what you must! do what it takes!

[Swift]

fellas...remember...common sense is not so common any longer...

washington is the problem NOT the soldiers, sailors, marines and airmen...

RULES OF ENGAGEMENT: do what you must! do what it takes!


Agree DON! Shoot first ask/answer questions later.;)