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View Full Version : Air Travel With a Firearm 2013 Style


Rapier
01-07-2013, 01:50 PM
I have for many years made it a practice when I travel around the globe to go hunting or traveling with firearms to only travel on American Air lines when at all possible. Their service and reliability has always been exemplary. Well that idea came to a crashing end on January 3rd 2013 when I stood in line for two hours waiting to get a firearm checked in by the only person on duty, for American Airlines, at the time, that was allowed to check in firearms at the Las Vegas airport that morning.

This morning started by my having a premonition for some reason, of a disaster. So I wanted to leave for the airport early although I was booked, checked in and had my boarding passes in hand, all done by computer months, then days, then hours ahead of time. I am a nut about not having any missteps in flights. I know how difficult it is to get another flight today if you miss connections. Nothing I imagined prepared me for what was to transpire.

We arrived at the air terminal two and one half hours early and were met with long lines at the ticket counters and helpful aids at the funnel points. Being told that I needed to get my wife’s and my boarding pass from a kiosk, I told the aid that I had our boarding passes in hand and just needed to check my baggage. I then just casually mentioned that I had to check in a firearm at the counter.

At that point we got an education in the new American Airlines. They filed bankruptcy in 2012, in the process they terminated the vast majority of their employees and hired independent contractors to provide labor. Now here is the catch, no one in American Airlines but an actual employee can do certain functions and one of those functions that the contractors are prohibited from doing is checking in a firearm. We apparently just hit the right person on the outgoing leg of this round trip and nary a problem was had nor anything said to indicate a problem might come later. The Las Vegas Airport on this day had one person that could check in a firearm and that person was selling tickets to non-ticketed people and changing flights for passengers, including non-English speaking foreigners that had no clue of what he was saying nor did he know what they were saying, in other words, a giant gaggle.

We stood in line for an hour and one half watching a total goat roping going on before we got to put our bag in the pedestal and asked that it be checked in. Then we found ourselves being informed that we needed TSA locks so the TSA could unlock our case, which is totally against the law with a firearm. No one is supposed to access a firearm once it is inspected and the case is locked except the owner and if the TSA wants to look at the firearm they are supposed to come get you to unlock the case, period. Was that the end, nope. We were then told to stand by while the TSA checked the bag. We were required to stand there for another 30 minutes, until we were released. By that time we could not get through security and transverse the entire airport in time to catch our flight out.

So we were faced with an employee that did not know the rules, who was in charge of the process and was performing his responsibility bass ackwards. By the time we got through this circus, we had missed our initial flight out and we ended up flying standby all day, trying to catch flight after flight until, after catching the very last flight of the day out of Dallas, we got home 5 hours late.

Where was our bag with the firearm inside? Just guess! Oh it made the initial flight and was sitting at our destination for 5 hours. All in all, a very unsatisfactory experience.

If you have an idea about flying with a firearm on American Airline, I suggest you either change airlines or you go at least 3 hours early. Did I mention that American now charges $25 per bag including the first bag and more for the second bags or any bag over 50 pounds, coming and going.

Things in life change, but you get used to a certain level of service and it is a shock to find out that service has changed so drastically.
Ed

Dan Morris
01-07-2013, 04:05 PM
After my last bout with American, I vowed never again! Is this now with all or just them?
Dan

buckhunter
01-08-2013, 09:08 AM
Its at a point where I consider shipping my firearms to avoid the hassle.

jplonghunter
01-13-2013, 07:06 AM
Ed
Thanks for the info,I have been considering hunt in Africa,but am very concerned about transporting rifles to and from by airlines.

Rapier
01-14-2013, 01:09 PM
Most times if you travel direct to your destination from the US you have little to no problem. But there are some "do not" things in your plans. Like do not travel through Britain or France. The stops in Britain are legendary for trouble and as with us, our guns were pulled off our plane, in the US, due to weight problems with the plane itself. Then the guns were shipped by themselves through Paris to RSA. Our difficulty was a stop in Atlanta with a change to the South African Airlines. When we returned everyone denied responsibility for the damages cases and guns. The cases looked just like someone had thrown them out of the plane onto the runway. Long story short, everything was reparable and everything got repaired, at our expense. It was just aggravating.

Just buy the best case you can afford and expect it to get beat up. Whether or not the exterior damage transfers to the inside has a lot to do with how good (expensive) your case is. Quality aluminum over thick plywood should be a consideration unless you go with a real heavy duty polymer. Get wheels on one end so the heavy beast is easy to roll. Sorry but that is how it works when you go across the pond.
Ed

skeeter@ccia.com
01-15-2013, 06:43 AM
so then how do you go about shipping firearms in advance to your destination? Need go to ffl dealer and have them ship? Never had to do this so far but never know in future. It is hard to take the garbage we all have to put up with just because of someone else. My neighbor run over someone with their car....guess matter of time they will take my car from me because of what he did with his.

Rapier
01-15-2013, 11:19 AM
It has been several years since I renewed my FFL but my recollection is that anyone can ship a firearm to a licensed dealer anywhere in the country, direct, without going through an originating dealer. The idea that shipping must be dealer to dealer has nothing at all to do with the rules applying to a dealer.
Ed

skeet
01-15-2013, 01:09 PM
But when you ship to a dealer you will have to do the 4473 form again and be approved to purchase the gun. If you pawn a gun..and go back to get it out of pawn..you have to do the 4473 form again with the NICS check all over again..for your own gun?? Take a gun to a gunsmith..You MAY have to do the NICS check again..some gunsmith's do it..some don't. You can send a gun to the manufacturer for repairs and they will send it back directly to you though..At least I think..

Rapier
01-16-2013, 05:00 PM
Skeet, unfortunately, if a dealer takes in a firearm and enters it on his books there must be a record of the disposition of that firearm. For example say the dealer shipped the firearm from his inventory to another dealer he must make note and have a current (at time of transfer) file copy of the dealer's FFL in his files.

If a dealer were to receive a package addressed to you C/O him and the package was never opened, I would think the dealer would have grounds to deny his ownership of the package or its contents. But, and here is the huge but, with the ATF, every agent can interpret the ATF regulations so if a question arises 99% of the dealers will err on the side of caution, thus you have so many folks doing what is unnecessary. They are simply afraid of the ATF, their own government and what it can and might do to them.

The worse thing is of course, you bring in a gun, it is simply repaired, need a sheet to get it back, you fail the background check and I as a dealer can not give you your own gun back.

This is the part of the gun regulations that is infuriating, and unintended. But unintended or no, it is still part of the garbage.
Ed

skeet
01-17-2013, 12:38 AM
Well Ed..I understand the "rules" but they are pretty stupid. If I take a gun to the local smith..it is mine and isn't or shouldn't be in his firearm acquisition records.. it should be in his repair book. That is what i had when I fixed guns. Possibly one of the reasons I had "words" with the BATF guy doing my records. But that was Clinton era wanting to get rid of FFLs time. After the last visit in 95..I kept my license till late 96(after the guy said they weren't gonna renew it). We got that straight with his boss along with him wanting to open my factory sealed AR-15 Colt match guns..He wanted to "make sure" they hadn't been converted to full auto..What part of factory sealed didn't he understand?? I really did tell him if he was armed I would consider it armed robbery if he opened the boxes...cause it woulda cost me money.. He really didn't like my answer to him opening the boxes. I was also armed you see. But we got through it after his boss reamed him on the phone. Dealing with the BATF has been easier since I got rid of the FFL. I did just apply for a C&R though.. We'll see how that goes. The bad thing about having an FFL is that anything you may do wrong..even paperwork is a FELONY and the US Attorney will prosecute..even if they don't prosecute an armed felon for using a gun in the commission of a crime..a 5 year no parole violation which they NEVER prosecute...Sorry I think I am just PO'd about all this stupid blame the gun things going on now

Rapier
01-17-2013, 09:08 AM
:D Ah yes, You understand exactly what I was talking about and why I as you, did not renew my license. You found yourself victim of the whims of an ATF agent and as I, fund it damned insulting that an individual could with, in effect, rule book in hand and tell you you were wrong when the regulations are clearly in your favor. When an individual representing the US Government has the athority to insult, coerce, extort, or remove your source of livelyhood, that power is way beyond the veil.

The government is like a cammel, it is never satisfied with an inch of its nose in your tent.

I shoot clays with a retired ATF agent (one of our regular group) and every now and then he says something that irks the group. I just give him my best "you dum butt" look and go on. He is like a stone in a brook, gradually getting rolled smooth.
Ed

powell&hyde
01-25-2013, 07:08 PM
Wow, thanks for the heads up. American Airlines off the reservations.