[bigbrother]

Ol spark and I have both shot deer approaching 800yds. Yes they were 1st shot kills, no "spotter" rounds were fired. BUT, we also knew exactly how far away they were: measured with a WILDE (sweedish optical range finder used in WWII for artilery). I know from experience there are only 2 lazers you can buy over the counter that will range a deer beyond 600 yds. Both are from Leica and only one of them does it all the time. We also knew the exact wind speed (our longest shot was in a 4.7mph cross wind). We use a Kestrel wind meter as it gives us wind speed, barometric pressure, and temperature readings. As a side note, these shots were made from a standing position using a solid rest (not against a tree) but from an ultimate tripod.

The gun was a custom 6.5x284 firing handloaded 140g Hornady AMAX bullets. (actual BC of .618 w/ muzzle velocity of 2940fps)

All of that being said, it all falls upon the hunter. We are the only ones at the moment of truth that can make the decision to take the shot or not. We are the ones that have to live with knowing we made a good decision or bad.

I typically fire well over 200 rounds a summer through my 6.5 at groundhogs and other targets out to as far as I can see them. I know exactly where my bullet will hit. Some might take that statement as b.s. and I understand as it's hard to believe that a gun will put all shots into 1/2moa at all distances fired. Note I said 1/2 moa at all distances. A 1/2" gun at 100yds doesn't mean it will shoot less than 4" at 800! You need to shoot your gun at the distances you want to hunt at. This isn't to say that my gun won't miss; it is simply a mechanism. It still requires a human to hold and pull the trigger. That is where the error comes in and where we as hunters need to take responsibility.

When someone tells me that they shot an elk or deer at 800yds and just held the cross hairs on his back I feel a great sympothy for them. They don't realize what they are doing to the hunting community and they apparantly have no concept of ballistics. When we long range hunt, we use a drop and wind chart for the particular gun we are shooting. The deer we shot at 742 yards 2 seasons ago, we adjusted up 17.25 moa: now lets talk about math....
We all know that 1 moa at 100 yds is one inch...4 at 400..7.42 at 742yds. So you want to know how high you needed to hold over your desired target to hit dead on at 742: 7.42 in x 17.25 = 128" high (10'-8").

In the hunting world, that's too much for the average person to think about. And that's all I have to say about that.