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#1
11-12-2004, 10:11 AM
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Smokeless powder
I`m new to muzzleloading, and have been looking at the savage. What is the advantage with smokeless powder over pyrodex? Can other inlines shoot smokeless?
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#2
11-12-2004, 10:50 AM
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Welcome to HC
The 777 powder will clean up alot faster than BP & Pyrodex. Alot of Muzzle Loader's will shoot them smokeless powders, But make sure you check to make sure before you load up.
I know it sure cuts down on cleaning time, and I only use 100gr of it in all mine. I like Knight muzzleloader's and they all shoot it rather well.
__________________
~If I ever find my Inner-Self, I'd Kill it too.~
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#3
11-12-2004, 01:44 PM
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Re: Welcome to HC
Quote:
not 777 there is a Savage MuzzleLoader that allows you to use the Same powder you put in a cartridge when you reload. The only disadvantage to the Savage that uses Smokeless that I can think of is it falls under the same regulations that a modern rifle falls under as far as FFL regulations. It is not like a true Black Powder gun that can be mail ordered and purchased without a BG check The biggest advantage is that it can be loaded to velocities beyond that of a traditional or inline BlackPowder rifle. You can get better accuracy and longer range that you can with the typical inline
__________________
I am PETA's #1 Member People Eating Tasty Animals 
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#4
11-12-2004, 01:55 PM
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__________________
I am PETA's #1 Member People Eating Tasty Animals
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#6
11-14-2004, 05:18 AM
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smokeless savage
Better look at the warning,about these guns at hpmuzzleloading.com
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#7
11-17-2004, 03:31 PM
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I own a Savage MZ as well as several Knight MZ's. If I had to choose only one it would hands down be the Savage. With the wonderful Savage Accutrigger and a recommended load of 4227 and 250gr SST's, I can shoot shot after shot into a 1" group at 100 yards without the need to ever clean it. Couple this with the fact that the bullets leave the muzzle at around 2200fps, and the bullet strikes 3" low at 200 yards with a 3" high at 100 yard zero. It is an effortless gun to shoot and shot well.
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#8
11-17-2004, 03:33 PM
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Re: smokeless savage
Quote:
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#9
11-17-2004, 04:06 PM
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pr bullet has a article on the savage. www.prbullet.com
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#10
11-19-2004, 05:11 AM
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Re: Re: smokeless savage
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I would rather err on the side of safety than take a chance,but thats just me. I do a lot of my deer hunting in southern In,pike and dubois county, maybe get together sometime and see if that smokeless can out shoot my Encore. Check your PM's: Last edited by EncoreBilly; 11-19-2004 at 06:34 AM.
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#11
11-20-2004, 06:59 AM
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The savage is the best muzzleloader i have ever shot. The smokless loads have less recoil than pyrodex and are faster, and at least as accurate. I have around 800 rounds on mine, i mic`ed a new breach plug, there was very little difference in either. Still after reading the warning, i`ll replace it at 1000 rounds, just to be safe. Okay, now for those of you who are curious, yes smokless powder can be fired in a modern inline, like the knight disk, and the TC encore, If you don`t care to lose life or limb. Again, no one says this is safe, but the starter load is 20 grains of hodgden lil`gun with a 225-230 grain bullet and the max is around 31 grains. You must also use MMP high pressure sabots. I have shot hundreds of rounds with no mishaps, but that does`nt mean anything, be careful, and replace the breech plug every 300 rounds or so.
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#12
12-09-2004, 09:20 PM
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Re: Re: smokeless savage
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__________________
skeet@huntchat.com Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" Benjamin Franklin
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#13
12-31-2004, 11:46 AM
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Re: Smokeless powder
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All the other ML powders, Pyrodex, Black Mag 3., T7, Clean Shot, ClearShot, and American Pioneer are NOT smokeless powders, they are "black powder substitutes", which are supposed to be better than real black powder in some respect or the other, but have their disadvantages as well! Most are safr than BP to store and handle, but some are much more difficult to ignite, and cannot be used in a flintlock unless a priming charge of true black powder is poured in the barrel first, and BP is required in the flashpan as well.
__________________
"It seems very difficult to impress most reloaders with the fact that every rifle is an individual, and what proves to be a maximum load in one may be quite mild in another, and vice versa." Bob Hagel, GAME LOADS AND "PRACTICAL BALLISTICS FOR THE AMERICAN HUNTER, 1977 The inmates are still running the asylum! "If you are 20 years old and not a liberal, you have no heart. If you are 40 and not a conservative, you have no brain!" W. Churchill 
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#14
02-13-2005, 05:08 PM
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do not use smokeless powder!too high a pressure for your barrel.
one shot too many you will be stat,if it helps 777 is cleaner than pyrodex.just soap and water maybe a tooth brush but you will live.no time to be lazy black powder is fun but dirty you must clean your gun and all parts. as for pellet loads a group of us up here in canada are wondering if the 2nd pre charge affects the barrel(ie two pellets both have primer charge) any data back would be great.this seems to only affect the barrels of people who use sabolts.the palstic is fouling the in line barrels. good luck
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#15
02-14-2005, 10:22 PM
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Smokeless Muzzleloaders
The Savage and several other makers allow smokeless powders. Other's have toyed with smokeless as well.
Smokeless powders offer three advantages to me. One is that it is cheaper per shot than triple seven or other powders except maybe Pyrodex P, for me. A can of 3031 or 5744 are $28 and Pyrodex for me is $14. I use 70 grains to 90 grains of Pyrodex , and up to 40 grains of 3031. Pretty close on price. Smokeless is cleaner, but not clean. As mentioned, recoil to energy served is vastly reduced. Lastly, smokeless powders are easy to get even here in Hawaii, shotgun primers are easier to get than are musket caps which I have to buy by the caselot ... $225 and now that I have modified my rifle to shoot with cartridges, the pistol primers too are way easier to get than are #11's or musket caps... therefore... smokeless has that peripheral advantage also. Smokeless powders in guns not designed for them, or for guns that one does not have the blessings of the manufacture for, should not be experimented with. Smokeless is in no way related to black powder or its substitutes when it comes to energy per grainweight of powder, and until you have some official guidline (FROM THE MANUFACTURER) you don't know what is a safe load for the gun. This brings up HP Muzzleloading. Toby Bridges, who also happens to be a friend of mine, had a gun that blew up on him. Toby took the path of criticizing Savage of their design of the breech plug. Savage, and others, have subsequently smeared Toby by publishing personal emails and other "private" documents on the internet. This precludes me from looking at any of the parties as behaving in a responsible manner in this issue. There is no reason to suspect that the Savage is anything but a fine muzzleloader. Why this particular one blew up, is probably anyones guess, and Toby is the only one who is likely ever to know for sure. Anyone who purchases a Savage in my opinion should follow the recommendations of Savage and enjoy their muzzleloader for a lifetime. Smokeless powder is a dream to shoot. It is smooth, less recoil, clearner, and nicer to shoot when compared to Black Powder or Pyrodex. Smokeless powder muzzleloaders are just going to become more and more popular as more and more people shoot them, and more and more states accept them. But you DON'T use smokeless powders in your Knight, CVA, Thompson, etc. Much Aloha ... 
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