gas prices

[DaMadman]

Sorry Guys, I just do not buy the sales pitch that the refineries we have were running af full capacity before the Hurricane, It wouldn't make economic sense to do it, If they were runnig at full capacity they would be making more fuel then they could sell and that is not good business sense to make more of something than you can sell.

I think now that the Refinery down in the gulf is gone the refineries that are left would have to run wide open to keep up with demand but from everything I have ever heard and read they could do it without too much trouble

If it is the case that one refinery goes down and gas prices skyrocket in one week, how come the prices at the pump do not jump sky high everytime they take a plant offline to maintenance a refinery plant?

[DogYeller]

So Madman, what you're saying is we don't need to build any new refineries?

[skeeter@ccia.com]

Don't forget too that not only gasoline gets made from the crude oil...At the different stages of refinery, we get the things like gasoline,diesel, kerosene home heating oil and ahhh..get this...highway emulsion for blacktop...you would be suprised how much emulsion is used to make a ton of asphalt. I use to haul it in tankers for them. Asphalt.. the kind PennDot here in Pa dumps over the hill at the end of the day because they didn't get it all down...down in what?...They sure don't use it to patch potholes...lol...I just spent well over $1000 for front end repair on my truck due to bad roads..they pave roads and next year take them back up and do them over...WASTE...and with this waste going on, I don't see any need for me to ration my needs..The governor just gave tax relief on gasoline in the southern states and that is what is needed here in Pa and all the rest of the states inc Canada..Our great governor Randell just imposed an added few cents per gallon to give (transportation) to the people that ride busses and I let him hear about that too...We that pay at the pumps and the initial cost of a vehicle, + cost of insurance ( because everyone finds a lawyer and sues)..which by the way is why we can't afford medical insurance either...have the cost of inspections..( I have to have emmission sticker at $50 while just 6 miles from here all around they need one...the cost of vehicle repairs as stated above and they NEED to tax us at the pump so someone with no vehicle can ride the bus....they did this because they didn't want to raise the cost of bus fare....we at the pumps pay for everything in taxes....contact the reps and let them cut some of the taxes.......if that is the only solution because as they lead us to believe the problem lies in the cost of crude oil....NOT.

[fabsroman]

DaMadman,

Seems as though you want your cake and you want to eat it too. You want to live an hour away from work in a nice neighborhood, you want to send your kids to a nice school, you want to keep your gov't job with all the benefits, and you want gas prices to be low.

Got news for you, the execs and stockholders at all the oil companies want the same thing as you and they need to make money to get it. Everybody knew what they were into when they took their jobs and bought their vehicles. If it was a long commute, they knew they would be in for a doozy if gas prices went up. If they bought a SUV or truck, they knew they would be in for a doozy if gas prices went up.

Now gas prices went up and everybody is complaining because they want there cake and they want to eat it too. Just like you have the freedom to live where you live and work where you work, the gas companies should have the freedom to charge whatever they want for gas until we stop buying it.

Everybody wants to lower taxes, but they also want to get rid of traffic congestion by building more roads. We want better police officers and Court systems but we don't want to pay taxes.

Everybody wants, but nobody is willing to give up anything either.

For what I paid for my townhouse, I could have bought a 3,200 sf house in Gainesville, Virginia right next to where my fiance works. However, we determined that I could not change clientele, but she could change Target locations, so we bought in Maryland right in the middle of my clients and the Courts.

Yes, I would love to live in a 3,200 sf house that is brand new instead of a 1,800 sf townhouse that is 7 years old. Yes, I would love to drive my new truck more instead of having to drive my Taurus all the time now because of gas prices. I would even love to own my own farm.

However, I understand that I cannot have everything I want in this world. Americans are starting to get soft in that they want everything and they want it today. That is why the average American household has several thousands of dollars on credit cards at a time and they cannot get rid of the debt. Yes, I want to buy an Armalite AR-10, a Beretta PX4 Storm when it is available, a Beretta 687EL Gold, a .25-06 Ruger MKII77VT, and a Ford 500, Ford Fusion, Ford Explorer, Ford Expedition, or Lincoln Zephyr, but I realize that I cannot have everything I want. I want a 5,000 sf house right next to where I am currently living, but I understand that I cannot have that either.

Like the rest of you, I want gas prices to be cheaper, along with the cost of food, health insurance, malpractice insurance, housing, taxes, guns, ammunition and everything else I want, however, that is not the way it works.

Everybody complaining about the gas prices reminds me of people complaining about health insurance.

We have a bill of rights and that bill does not include the right to:

1. Gas
2. Health Insurance
3. A luxury house
4. A SUV
5. A long happy life

We all need to prioritize what is important and go from there. In my area, everybody lives in Frederick and further north and commutes down to Bethesda and DC to work.

At the end of the day, I just don't see spending 10 hours a week on the road commuting back and forth to work or spending the money on gas. Assuming that it is an hour drive each way and you are doing 60 mph on average that would be 31,200 commuting miles a year. If your car gets 25 mpg, that would be 1,248 gallons a year to commute which ends up being $3,744 a year just in gas if gas is $3 a gallon. If you buy a $20,000 car that will last for 150,000 miles before needing to be replaced, that would be $4,000 a year in depreciation on that car. We are already at $8,000 a year and we haven't even touched the cost of insurance when you are truthful and tell them that you have a 60 mile one way commute to and from work each day or the cost of maintaining the vehicle. So, lets just round it out to $10,000 a year to commute. Might as well spend that money on a house closer to work even if your mortgage is an extra $1,000 a month.

Not to mention all the time wasted driving to and from work which is 520 hours a year if you have to commute one hour each way.

Stop crying and do something about the situation, and choose what is important to you and make the sacrifices you need to make to get it.

[DaMadman]

Originally posted by DogYeller
So Madman, what you're saying is we don't need to build any new refineries?

No I am not saying that we shouldn't build new refineries. I think we should, so that we can refine as much as possible and drop the prices even more.

i think NEW refineries would be a good Idea, that way they couldn't use it an an excuse to jack up the gas prices.

What I am saying is that from everything that I have read and seen, the refineries that we do have right now CAN keep up with demand if they up production. They might not be able to stockpile anything extra but they could keep up.

But new refineries would be great, the more refineries the more they can produce and the more competition there would be and the better gas prices would get for you and I. As I understand it the New Technology the new refineries are more efficient and produce less polution than the ones we have now

[DaMadman]

Originally posted by fabsroman
DaMadman,

Seems as though you want your cake and you want to eat it too. You want to live an hour away from work in a nice neighborhood, you want to send your kids to a nice school, you want to keep your gov't job with all the benefits, and you want gas prices to be low.

Got news for you, the execs and stockholders at all the oil companies want the same thing as you and they need to make money to get it. Everybody knew what they were into when they took their jobs and bought their vehicles. If it was a long commute, they knew they would be in for a doozy if gas prices went up. If they bought a SUV or truck, they knew they would be in for a doozy if gas prices went up.

Now gas prices went up and everybody is complaining because they want there cake and they want to eat it too. Just like you have the freedom to live where you live and work where you work, the gas companies should have the freedom to charge whatever they want for gas until we stop buying it.

Everybody wants to lower taxes, but they also want to get rid of traffic congestion by building more roads. We want better police officers and Court systems but we don't want to pay taxes.

Everybody wants, but nobody is willing to give up anything either.

For what I paid for my townhouse, I could have bought a 3,200 sf house in Gainesville, Virginia right next to where my fiance works. However, we determined that I could not change clientele, but she could change Target locations, so we bought in Maryland right in the middle of my clients and the Courts.

Yes, I would love to live in a 3,200 sf house that is brand new instead of a 1,800 sf townhouse that is 7 years old. Yes, I would love to drive my new truck more instead of having to drive my Taurus all the time now because of gas prices. I would even love to own my own farm.

However, I understand that I cannot have everything I want in this world. Americans are starting to get soft in that they want everything and they want it today. That is why the average American household has several thousands of dollars on credit cards at a time and they cannot get rid of the debt. Yes, I want to buy an Armalite AR-10, a Beretta PX4 Storm when it is available, a Beretta 687EL Gold, a .25-06 Ruger MKII77VT, and a Ford 500, Ford Fusion, Ford Explorer, Ford Expedition, or Lincoln Zephyr, but I realize that I cannot have everything I want. I want a 5,000 sf house right next to where I am currently living, but I understand that I cannot have that either.

Like the rest of you, I want gas prices to be cheaper, along with the cost of food, health insurance, malpractice insurance, housing, taxes, guns, ammunition and everything else I want, however, that is not the way it works.

Everybody complaining about the gas prices reminds me of people complaining about health insurance.

We have a bill of rights and that bill does not include the right to:

1. Gas
2. Health Insurance
3. A luxury house
4. A SUV
5. A long happy life

We all need to prioritize what is important and go from there. In my area, everybody lives in Frederick and further north and commutes down to Bethesda and DC to work.

At the end of the day, I just don't see spending 10 hours a week on the road commuting back and forth to work or spending the money on gas. Assuming that it is an hour drive each way and you are doing 60 mph on average that would be 31,200 commuting miles a year. If your car gets 25 mpg, that would be 1,248 gallons a year to commute which ends up being $3,744 a year just in gas if gas is $3 a gallon. If you buy a $20,000 car that will last for 150,000 miles before needing to be replaced, that would be $4,000 a year in depreciation on that car. We are already at $8,000 a year and we haven't even touched the cost of insurance when you are truthful and tell them that you have a 60 mile one way commute to and from work each day or the cost of maintaining the vehicle. So, lets just round it out to $10,000 a year to commute. Might as well spend that money on a house closer to work even if your mortgage is an extra $1,000 a month.

Not to mention all the time wasted driving to and from work which is 520 hours a year if you have to commute one hour each way.

Stop crying and do something about the situation, and choose what is important to you and make the sacrifices you need to make to get it.

Sorry Fabs but you sound rediculous, spewing that crap about having my cake and eat it too.
#1 I live in a DECENT house in a DECENT neighborhood. I don't live in one of these houses that are going on the market for $500,000 I live in a modest brick rambler out in the country on an acre and a half and my house cost me $125,000 8 years ago and is now worth more than I could afford to buy it for.

I don't think that living in a decent neighborhood so my kids don't live in a crime infested area and don't go to school with punks and drug addicts, and having a decent paying job is having my cake and eating it too. It think that I leave my house the minute my son gets on the bus and don't get home until 7-7:30 everynight, My wife leaves the house at 5:30-6:00 and gets home to get my son off the bus so we don't incur daycare fees so that we can afford to live where we live and keep my family away from SOME of the crime and bullshit. Having my Cake and eating it too huh?




To Top that off I drive the vehicles I drive out of neccesity, I have a Bronco II that is on it's last leg because I drive it 60 miles round trip everday and I chose that vehicle because it gets decent gas mileage and has 4 wheel drive so that I can get to work in the winter when it snows, and I have the dodge truck that I use when the Bronco is down for repair and if I need to go to the dump or get mulch or pull my camper or any number of things you use a truck for. Of course I could just buy some little P.O.S. compact car that gets 33 MPG, stay home when it snows and hope and pray on a daily basis that I don't get in an accident and get sandwiched between an SUV and a tractor trailer and get killed.

Not to metion that gasoline isn't something I WANT to buy and spend my Money on, it is something that I HAVE to have along with millions of other americans.

How about someone that went to college, gets to work from home, lives in and affluent neighborhood in a $450,000 town house owns 2 vehicles and has the option to just up and trade one of them in on a hybrid, doesn't have the expense of a kid in college and one in public school., and when they do have kids will probably send them to private school......... Hmmm who's eating cake here

My freaking point is there is no GD reason that the United Stated is one of the wealthiest Countries in the World, we are exporting Crude oil every damn day to other countries and yet we are paying $3-$4 for a gallon of gas. There is no excuse for it

[BILLY D.]

ohhhhhhh, boy i can't wait to hear the glazed over answer to that one madman.

stay tuned for further developments.

p.s. excellent reply.

[DaMadman]

Originally posted by BILLY D.
ohhhhhhh, boy i can't wait to hear the glazed over answer to that one madman.

stay tuned for further developments.

p.s. excellent reply.

Thanks Billy.

Fabs and I have known each other for a few years now and even shoot clays together on occasion but that last post was a bit more than I could take and not hold my tongue Hehehehe

[Rocky Raab]

I hope I'm not glazed over, Billy. But here goes...

(Oh, first let me congratulate all for keeping this discussion civil. Good guys all here at HC. Some of the other boards I read are wall-to-wall flames over this topic. You folks are the best.)

Not to put words in Fab's mouth, but the way I read his "cake" post was this: We all make our choices, but having made them, we ought to suck it up and live with the inevitable results of those choices.

Neither Fab's nor Madman's choices are good - or bad. They just are. I'd guess that those choices were made because each of them thought them the best solution. Maybe they were then, and maybe they still are the best. Or maybe not. Nobody knows what the next five minutes will bring us.

But I can promise that whatever happens, it probably wasn't expected!

The choices we make every day are a crap shoot. Maybe that SUV saved your life on a snowy road, and you don't even know it. Maybe that short commute did the same. On the other hand, people die every day because of choices they made. Maybe we just wanted five minutes more sleep, and that put us a tad late, and so we run that long yellow light, and... You get the idea.

Back to the point of the thread (at last LOL!)...

There's no point bitching about the price of gas. It is what it is. You can pay it (that's one decision) or not (and that's another) but we all need to abide by the results of the choice. Nothing you can do as an individual will change it. Nothing, that is, unless you single-handedly build your own refinery (and lotsa luck with THAT decision, the envirowhackos and laws being what they are).

But if you do build it, don't whine about how expensive it is to run the thing, and how you can't break even unless you raise the prices. It was your choice!

Thanks again for the calm and rational talk, guys. If we get together, the beer's on me.

[DaMadman]

Originally posted by Rocky Raab
I hope I'm not glazed over, Billy. But here goes...

(Oh, first let me congratulate all for keeping this discussion civil. Good guys all here at HC. Some of the other boards I read are wall-to-wall flames over this topic. You folks are the best.)

Not to put words in Fab's mouth, but the way I read his "cake" post was this: We all make our choices, but having made them, we ought to suck it up and live with the inevitable results of those choices.

Neither Fab's nor Madman's choices are good - or bad. They just are. I'd guess that those choices were made because each of them thought them the best solution. Maybe they were then, and maybe they still are the best. Or maybe not. Nobody knows what the next five minutes will bring us.

But I can promise that whatever happens, it probably wasn't expected!

The choices we make every day are a crap shoot. Maybe that SUV saved your life on a snowy road, and you don't even know it. Maybe that short commute did the same. On the other hand, people die every day because of choices they made. Maybe we just wanted five minutes more sleep, and that put us a tad late, and so we run that long yellow light, and... You get the idea.

Back to the point of the thread (at last LOL!)...

There's no point bitching about the price of gas. It is what it is. You can pay it (that's one decision) or not (and that's another) but we all need to abide by the results of the choice. Nothing you can do as an individual will change it. Nothing, that is, unless you single-handedly build your own refinery (and lotsa luck with THAT decision, the envirowhackos and laws being what they are).

But if you do build it, don't whine about how expensive it is to run the thing, and how you can't break even unless you raise the prices. It was your choice!

Thanks again for the calm and rational talk, guys. If we get together, the beer's on me.

Rocky you are right in your word as usual, and building my own refinery is on my list of things to do as soon as I fine myself and old deisel car or truck.
I am seriously thinking that if gas stays up over $2.50 a gallon for too long I am going to start looking into the local restraunts that have used cooking oil and offer to haul it away for free.

Most large restraunts have lots of used cooking oil that they use in the deepfryers and they have to pay to have it hauled off.
Instead I am thinking about getting a old deisel vehicle and making Bio-deisel out of that oil. It is easy to do and would help me as well as the restraunts.

for any of you that already run deisel trucks or cars you should look into it.

The recipe consists of used cooking oil, Lye (reddevil drain cleaner), and a small amount of methanol (racing fuel)

I watched a guy on TV make 35 gallons and it took 35 gallons of used cooking oil, added about a cup of lye and a half gallon of racing fuel (methanol) and filtered it to get out any suspended food particles and pumped it straight into an F-350 deisel truck.

All of the on campus shuttle buses at the University of Maryland run on biodeisel made this way, the science department makes the fuel for them.


I'll wait and see if the prices drop back down first but if they don't this is seriously a solution that I am thinking about giving a try.

When Cigarettes went sky high in Maryland and the police started cracking the whip on buying them in Virginia and bringing them back to Maryland I bought my own cigarette machine, bulk tobacco, filter tubes and made my own cigarettes for almost a year. Now that the law has been cleared up and set that it is legal to buy up to 2 cartons for personal use, I normally go to Va for something or other about once a month and I just pick up 2 carton for me and 2 for the wife and since she doesn't smoke very often they last me till the next time I get to Va.

Point being it wouldn't be a stretch for me to setup a strainer and mix up my own bio-deisel out in the garage to save a couple hundre a month on my gas bill

[Lilred]

The answer to all our problems: buy a horse

On a lighter note (not to butt into ya'lls compellin discussion)
but folks round here was goin as crazy as a cat in a room fulla rockin chairs today. We dont have alot of those "big" new gas stations here..most of em are the old pumps that you caint put a credit card in and they dont even have the digital numbers on em..remember them? They'll reset the "odometer" readin when ya turn em on...lol..we are backwoods..and a bunch of old fashioned hardheads I reckon.
Anyways..those pumps stopped readin at 2.99$..there was no number 3 in em..so when gas hit 3 dollars here..all the old gas stations couldnt sell gas..and everybody thought we'd have to hole up fer a while lol..it was perty funny.
On another note..lumber is insane. The lumber market is gittin turned inside out..we spent most of the day today decidin on what we should limit buyers to and whatnot. Was perty crazy today..on that note..I just reminded myself how tirit I am.
I still say..buy a horse

[fabsroman]

Rocky understands my post completely.

My point is that everybody has made choices in life and everybody wants to complain about how bad they have it.

Me, I made the choice to put myself through law school and was poor as could be until I was 28. My parents paid for undergrad, but that was only if I agreed to commute from their house to college. Undergrad cost them $8,000 total. I worked for 2 years out of undergrad to try and save enough to go to law school. Law school cost me around $30,000. During that entire time, I barely spent any money on anything and drove a 1980 Ford Fairmont even though I had the Mustang because I CHOSE to keep the Mustang like new. The Fairmont up and died on me when I graduated law school and I had to buy the Taurus, with hardly enough money for a down payment, because I just got out of school. Good thing is that I got out of school debt free, with the exception of the 0% interest loan on the Taurus.

Throughout law school, I CHOSE to live with my parents, which wasn't always fun, but they were gracious enough to allow me to live there for a very modest rent amount. I CHOSE this so I could graduate without any loans. The first year in law school I worked as a video store clerk part time making a little over $5 an hour. My second and third years of law school I worked as a law clerk making $12 an hour. Almost all of that money went toward paying for law school. So I wasn't rich. When I graduated law school, I was offered a job for $35,000 a year and $40,000 a year once I got sworn in. It has been 7 years since then and I have been making pretty good money over the last 5 with my practice starting to get really busy right now.

So, lets just make one thing clear here, things haven't been all roses for me either.

I would have loved to be married with kids by the time I was 25 so that I wouldn't be an old man when they grow up, but I chose differently so I could make a better future for me and subsequently my family.

We all make decisions in life, but we shouldn't expect the federal government to bail us out of everything.

DaMadman,

You made the decision to live far from work so that you could afford a decent house in a decent neighborhood. You bought your house 8 years ago when they were reasonable. I could be on here complaining to no end about how ridiculous house prices are because I bought my first house last year. 7 years ago, this place cost $156,000 and I could have made that money clear in 4 or 5 years to pay the entire thing off. Now, the townhouse I bought cost $333,000 and in the one year I have been here, it has gone to $425,000. You can imagine what the houses around here are, they are astronomical. What the wife and I have been looking at is in the $1,000,000 range. The cheapest homes around here are $700,000 unless you want to live in a house from World War II in the worst part of the city.

Here is an example of wanting your cake and wanting to eat it too. You want to be safe while driving so you want to drive a big car. Yet, you don't want to pay the additional price for gas. That leads me to another point from my earlier post. Everybody wants things, but we cannot have it all. You cannot have a big, rather safe SUV, and a cheap gas bill when you live a million miles from work.

I was in Arizona for my honeymoon and saw land for sale for $100 an acre. With just $10,000 I could have a 100 acres to build a house on and live in style. Problem is, I wouldn't have any clients. Your complaining about the price of gas and your commute to work is akin to me moving to Arizona in the middle of nowhere and then complaining about not having any clients and having to drive 2 hours to the supermarket at these gas prices. Hence, I quickly decided that buying a place out there would not be the right choice.

Now, I also know where you live and I know there are neighborhoods closer to DC than where you live and they aren't that bad. Do you work near a metro stop? If so, you can move right by me, drive 5 miles to the metro and take the metro into work for $5 a day and Montgomery County schools are some of the best in the nation.

See, there are always alternatives to get around things other than just complaining about them.

I used to hate taking the metro into DC, and I used to complain about the parking conditions in DC, the cost of parking in DC, and the traffic to get into DC. Decided that the negatives of the metro weren't as bad as the negatives about driving into DC, so the metro it is when I go to DC.

I have been watching 20/20 tonight and this post kind of reminds me about what I saw on there regarding the hurricane. Everybody is complaining about the situation and blaming the federal government for not preventing it or bailing them out from it quick enough. There is only so much the federal government can do without raising taxes, but nobody wants taxes raised either because WE ALL WANT OUR CAKE AND WE WANT TO EAT IT TOO. It would be kind of like California complaining about a catastrophic earthquake. Hello, you knew what it was when you moved there. New Orleans was protected by decades old levies, the failure of which would cause a flood in the city. The people knew that while they were living there, but now it is the governments fault that all this happened. People knew that they would consume a lot of gas by living far away from work and by buying SUV's, but now it is the government's fault that the price of gas went up and they are suffering. We all want to blame somebody else for our bad times.

Quite simply, I was raised by some very conservative parents straight from Italy after World War II. My uncle and aunt on my father's side remember the bombers dropping bombs in neighboring cities. My parents came over here with pretty much nothing. They worked hard, hardly ever complained about anything, and have done pretty well for themselves. When the "oil crisis" of the 70's hit, my dad stopped driving a pontiac sled and bought a very small FIAT. He also bought a lot of gas cans and filled them up from the Pontiac when he could get that car filled up. Thing is, he isn't complaining about the gas prices right now. He just went out before the prices went up and he filled up all of his gas cans. He doesn't drive his Crown Victoria or his F-150 around anymore, but drives his Chevy (gag) Cavalier instead.

I guess I am just tired of people making choices in life and then complaining about them later on when things change. Like I said, I could be on here complaining day and night about the housing situation in my area, and think I even did a couple of times in the past, but it is what it is, so I just have to increase my legal rate or the number of hours I work/bill. LOL

In the end, we can all complain night and day about the gas prices. It won't change anything, but if it makes you guys feel better, be my guest.

I seriously doubt that the federal government could or should set the price of gas. I also agree with the tax on gas because it is used to create and maintain the roads that people use to burn the gas on. Why should somebody who barely drives or never drives have to take up the cost of building roads?

One last thing, nobody NEEDS to buy gas. We CHOOSE and are FORCED to buy gas as a result of the previous decisions we make in life. If you truly couldn't afford gas, you would figure something out, but the current gas price is merely affecting your life style so you are complaining about it.

Guess what, the current gas price and housing market are affecting my lifestyle too, alond with a million other things, but I'll continue to make decisions in the future on how to deal with all these issues.

[BILLY D.]

the above reply is just what i expected.

[fabsroman]

Billy D,

Sorry I made you have to use a sad face, but I am glad that I didn't disappoint you or surprise you with my response. Everybody expects the federal government to solve their problems, but that just cannot be done. There is no way to make everybody happy.

Alas, you guys complaining about the gas prices will receive a reprieve.

"Bush also issued a memorandum saying the hurricane had created a "severe energy supply interruption" and formally authorized a drawdown of oil from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve. He said that the disruption had resulted in a severe increase in the price of oil products and that the price rise could damage the national economy." Quoted from a Yahoo article.

While cleaning up the kitchen and garage tonight, my parents have always said that Americans don't know what hard times are, and I think the rise in gas prices and Katrina pretty much prove that. My parents do not think that Americans are tough enough to make it through tough times, and they might actually be right. Don't get me wrong, my parents are diehard Americans, but they also know what it is like to live in tough times. Billy D, are you old enough to remember the Great Depression? I would think that the generation that lived through that might understand what hard times are like. I dated a girl once that had grandparents that lived through the Great Depression and even though they had a good amount of money, they saved everything that MIGHT be of use.

My parents are the same way as that girl's grandparents and I am always telling them to throw that crap out because the cost of storing it is more than the cost of buying it, but I guess I am only thinking of the here and now. What happens if you cannot buy that stuff anywhere. Then it becomes priceless.

Heck, I don't think I am as tough as my parents.

I guess it is a good thing we can still get gas. Otherwise, Danica would not be able to pursue her rise to fame. LOL

[Spammy]

Fabs,fabs,fabs.


Thought about you guys the other day and saw you had posted.
Alllways nice to read your post.You must be a pretty good lawer lol.I agree with you on somethings nay on others.I remembered you as always fair and willing to either concede a point or agree to disagree with aplomb.I agree you city slickers may be getting soft but there is 1.2 million idahoans who are very tough americans .(hehehehehehe)

I'm more concerned with the nations current crises.We do have a petro reserve but it is unrefined.You know we are in trouble when the french are agreeing to release refined gas from ther own reserve with the other 29 euro nations.

I also was thinking hybrid.Chevy came out this year with a 1/2 ton.I was going to wait for a year and let them work the bugs out
.
Dont understand the hostility from some of the post.Its a fact Americans want it all.Lets take inventory.I own and run daily 2 fullsize,2 midsize trucks.Toys I use on weekends, 3 dirt bikes for kids,my quad the boat.Do i over consume?You bet your ass.That is what i was taught.

Its also a fact we are going to pay the piper some day.Sooner or later we are going to run out of fossil fuel no disputing that.I had a really disturbing thought what if there is no plan by big oil for an alternate fuel?

As always Fabs you put a smile on my face with your well thought out post.I wont wait a year until i stop by again.

Mike