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#16
11-13-2006, 07:47 AM
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For PBR & all of the other Democrat voters here.
I just thought I'd share this little story about what Our supposed "Evil Armed Forces" are really doing, over in Iraq & Afghanistan, and some of why We need to be there.
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As you can see PBR, not everything is as you see it in the news, or reported to you buy your DNC "friends". There is so much good being done, that will never be shown....I know that the above story is one small example.....although I wouldn't put it passed the DNC to try to get more good news out when they are "back In" after January......And their buddies at the major news networks will be happy to help.... You see PBR, these same people who shot this girl, killed her family, and are trying to kill our soldiers over there... are the ones who rejoiced at Your electing the democrats back into power. Think about that for a minute....Why would this be? These same people, the exact same people who have stated that they want Every single Man, Woman, and child from the west DEAD, are happy because of your actions...... But, what do I know...I'm sure it's all an effect of "Global Warming"...which is Bush's fault too..of course.  I'll sure feel safe from now on................. NOT! Tall Shadow 
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#17
11-13-2006, 07:48 AM
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I will take time for this PBR. You pretty much shot yourself and your credibility down several times on your own, but the one that spoke the most volume to me is the FDR democrat statement.
I would be willing to guess that you are a multi generation democrat, no? Your daddy, his daddy, his daddys daddy all voted democrat and thats just way it is, not? My family is the exact same way. Im the only one with his own mind and realized that the parties values swapped sides somewhere down the line. My grandmother curses republicans, as much as she can without saying a bad word, shes a saint on earth. Anyway, I ask her about abortion, gay marriage, gun control and not supporting the military and she just cant believe the democratic party supports such things. Shes stuck in the FDR era as well. The democratic party today is not the same. Its not run by blue collar working men. Just look at the vote. In MO alone, republicans were winning and baby killing was losing, until what came in, PBR? Inner city St Louis and KC. What vote is that PBR? Its the black/minority vote. Are they voting for the working man? Hell no, they are voting for social programs. Its that way all across the country. And if you think democrats are soft on gun control, your dead ass wrong. You lost even more ground in my mind with your comments on some gun control being ok. I should give up some of my freedoms, for what? What good will gun control do? The bad guys gonna quit using them for crime because its against the law? They are not going to be able to get them if they are banned? Your full of it and you know it. PBR, your posts over the years and some of your admissions on another board was enough, but this one takes the cake. I do have to get to work now, but will be back. Admitted socialist. I didnt even think you were that far gone. Im sure as hell glad there arent more like you around. At least I hope not.
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#19
11-13-2006, 08:58 PM
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I don't think I've shot myself in the foot so to speak --- I'm mearly saying things that you guys don't agree with. There's a difference between ignorance and difference of opinion and I haven't crossed the line yet.
I don't have very much time so I'll keep it as brief as possible. As far as my education and teaching is concerened (economics, history, government, soc, psyc, etc), my main interest is sociology and culture. I believe that each culture/nation grows seperate from one another with many different histories. Most modern cultures believes theirs is the correct one. Christians didn't think twice about a mass genocide of jews and muslims in the name of god and gold during the Crusades. Now all of a sudden a Muslim Crusade is dead wrong. And I can see where we belief that - I do. It's an opposing side of a war and it also goes against christian morals. I do think muslim extremism is a problem that needs to be addressed. But comments I hear that ragheads must die --- every one of them --- are out of line. We have our own culture and we take the side of democracy. We have had our own history. As have the middle east - they have had their own history all these years. We have to understand that we have a democracy because we were ready for one. The middle east still functions best (based on their history) as religion states. WE all may be in the year 2006 but that doesn't mean that the world has caught up to eachother with morals, government, technology, etc. And we are making new World History as we speak. It will be interesting what will eventually play out 1000 years from now. Do I have socialist tendancies? Perhaps some. Perhaps alot. I definatly don't think it's fair to compare me to the thoughts of the former USSR, Cuba, and North Korea. I don't want to enter into this discussion as it's off topic but it's also not fair to compare these failed communists nations to the "ideal" (if you will) of socialism. You have to remember, no where in modern history was socialism actually given a fair chance --- just dictators ruling. I'm not saying we should be socialists - I'm not saying that at all. I just wanted to point out that socialism isn't a failed concept because it was really never tried in the sense. A final note on gun control - in particular the assult weapons. When you were in grade school you got punished for other kids dicking around. Well, people are dicking around with guns - and I'm not talking about criminals and gangs. I'm talking about free citizens doing stupid things with guns. People around here at 4 different ranges buy the cheapest ak, sks guns and all they do is go to the range with no other purpose that to shoot as many rounds as they can as fast as they can. Many disobey a range rule or two in the process as far as targets on backstops (because of homes in the area). You hav people shooting computers, laundry machines, pumpkins, etc. I almost watched a game warden get shot at at the range because he tried telling some kids to knock it off. I almost watched a drunk black guy shoot himself in the head because he tried to clear a jam on a pistol by pointing it at his head. Somehow the damned thing went off inchs from his head. There is some type of culture in the united states that says acting like a complete jack with a gun (in particular a high capacity assult weapon in my area) is the cool thing to do. In fact, it's very dangerous !!! There has to be some type of responcibily and accountability. Law enforcement can't be on public ranges at all times - not even .05% of the time. We have to teach eachother and our children how to behave with guns --- and it's not comming across very well in certain sectors of the country. Firearms serve 4 purposes 1. self defence 2. hunting 3. recreation 4. competition Somwhere #1 and #3 got out of control. We have to put it back into control. Is gun control the answer? Probably not Is no gun control the answer? Probably not There has to be sensible gun laws to protect everyone - both people trying to mind their own business as well as protect from one's self. I do not think assult weapons and semi-pistols are of themselves bad. There are responcible people out there using them. There's also a bunch of people who have no business doing so. Is this a good reason for wanting gun control --- that too many people are behaving like idiots --- I definatly think it is and I have a hunch many gun owners do as well. The future success to the gun industry is a respect for the sport and not creating negative impressions and dangerous situations. And perfect timing --- wrestling is comming on tv 
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#20
11-13-2006, 10:14 PM
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I'm going to have to {Snip} large parts of this in order to make it (A.) Fit, and (B.) be readable.
So here goes... Quote:
I'd call that "Shooting yourself in the foot." wouldn't you? Quote:
Man, by nature belongs free. Anything other than Freedom is just unnatural/wrong....Whatever the form of government he is under. Quote:
France is socialist.... Guess who's having ROP(Religion of Peace) troubles? If everything was perfect, in a perfect world, Communism would be a perfect form of government. BUT IT CAN NEVER BE! Any system, run by man, with man in the equation, can not be a perfect system...Man is flawed. The world is flawed... George Orwell said.... "Absolute Power, Corrupts Absolutely!" This is why our system is divided in to 3 branches. No one person controls everything. And the shining triumph of Our system, a Representative Republic is..... US! WE, hold the absolute power. We are guaranteed this by the restrictions placed on The Government by Our constitution. The 2nd amendment isn't about Duck hunting....It's about the power to be able to resist or destroy a tyrannical government, so that no one will ever be able to do what the kings/Queens of Europe did, to Us ever again. Look at the foolishness you just wrote below.... Quote:
I was a FFL(That's a Federal Fire Arms Dealer) before it became a minefield in the 1990's. Trust me when I say that the20,000+ Gun Laws we already have, are plenty...hence the other point that I've been trying to make you understand...OK, 1 More Time......Say it with me now!..... "You can NOT legislate morality!" Only honest people obey the law(s), Criminals by definition..DO NOT!....You could pass 20,000 more laws & guess what? They STILL won't obey them! Starting to get the picture yet? "Gun control" isn't about the guns, It's about the Control! Anyone why tells you different is LYING TO YOU SUNSHINE! Quote:
Is it not the person, with the intent...and not the inanimate object that should be the focus of your objections? Or should we remove all modes of transportation? These kill, Mame and injure millions each year, in even the most civil of countries? Far more that any violent crime(s). We need to fix out social situation, there in lyes your problem. Restricting one of our inalienable rights, is not an option. Tall Shadow
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#21
11-13-2006, 11:42 PM
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This is my last post on the matter as I've said eveything I wanted to as clearly as I was going to get it. No one seems to want to have a serouis objective discussion on issues, but instead a play on words. Members and I have had some very good discussions on politics here over the last 6 years, but this thread isn't going to be one of them.
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I hated Ronald, Bush, and W with a passion but over the last quarter century I can not say these republicans actually changed my life for the better or for the worse. We roll with the punches. You hated Clinton and you may hate the next clinton --- if that happens, is 16 years of Clinton going to change your life much? No We all freak out on politics too much. We all need to chill and not get so worked up. Thank you for a lively civil debate. I hope those that read this thread look at everything posted objectively and for what it is.
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#22
11-14-2006, 12:28 AM
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Did I miss something in debate class? Or Were we just "Playing" on debating? Quote:
whatever "That" was.....Quote:
I not only think your position on these subjects is incorrect, I have given documentation, and the reasons to show it is. Quote:
We ->should<- care about what goes on in the internal politics of Our country!, One way or the Other it WILL effect us and Our children. Quote:
(I was going to go on with this.....But Why?!? They never will actually debate any issue.... ) Whatever...... Tall Shadow
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#23
11-14-2006, 06:27 AM
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Tall Shadow, everything I was going to say while reading PBRs response, you said. Good posts.
I will say that PBRs final post is typical of liberals. Their ideas dont hold water so they must retreat or point fingers after the same old ideas are shot down, one after the other. However, I must say I did enjoy finally hearing a fresh liberal view on gun control. That is the very first time I have ever heard a liberal say they didnt want the guns out of the hands of the gangs but wanted people to quit shooting up old washing machines and refrigerators. Maybe Pelosi and Feinstein can hire PBR to help make the new laws coming down the pipe. If your having trouble with kids at the range acting up, thats the range and law enforcements problem for not dealing with it. Shame on them. I get annoyed at the range I go to all the time. Normally by quirky things that other members do but thats a personal problem. Gun laws are not going to save lives. They are not going to stop violence. And they are not going to save washing machines. They are just going to screw with law abiding citizens. You never did get the strong message Tall Shadow was trying to send. Your a social studies teacher. You of all people should know there is a fifth reason, number one actually. So the people can maintain a well armed malitia to guarantee we will never be ruled by tyrants again. Dont forget the Constitution.
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#24
11-14-2006, 09:54 AM
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I was planning on staying out of this one but after the last PBR comment I cannot. At NO TIME, let me repeat this AT NO TIME, can you EVER have "1. self defence " "out of control". Never not once. NO It CANNOT and WILL not happen. You CANNOT protect yourself enough, you CANNOT protect your family enough, you CANNOT protect your friends enough. All you can do is TRY to protect them. Comming from somebody who works for a police department let me tell you it does not happen. I have seen far to many people who just stood there and took it (from rape to robbery to murder) because somebody ELSE was going to come along and defend them. People who knew martial arts, one woman who had a freakin stun gun on her! She let it happen because you are not supposed to carry a stun gun on campus and she didn't want to get in trouble by defending herself!
People getting punished in elementary school shouldn't have a damned thing to do with adults in real life! I quit a job once upon a time because I had to raise my hand and ask permission to go take a leak or I would get written up! I AM NOT A CHILD! I don't NEED nor WANT your protection, permission, or sympathy! Your's OR the liberals in this country. What do I want? I want to be left alone. I hunt, fish, and work to provide for my family. I go to church, and I go to town to shop. I don't need you to serial number my chickens. I don't need you to inspect every catch or game I harvest. I don't need you to protect me, tax me, coddle me, tell me how great OR sorry I am or anything else. I am not affecting you or yours and I SHOULD NOT BE TREATED LIKE A CRIMINAL FOR IT! This country has SO gotten into the idea that we most monitor everything that everybody does that people have accepted this as normal. Normal! Why should I register a prepaid cell phone? I ALREADY paid for it. You won't have to send a collector to come get money. WHY should I have to register a vehicle I paid for with cash? Or a gun I paid for with cash? What next? Should I register my boots in case i decide to kick the living crap outa some turd who decides he wants to try to rob me? Maybe I should register my hands and feet since I practice martial arts. Maybe I should be in a national database of potential rapists since I am a man! After all I have the equipment right? RIGHT?! I choose every day who I am and what I do. I CHOOSE to be the good old boy that everybody can count on. I CHOOSE to protect my family, my friends, my neighbors, my coworkers, and strangers! Criminals CHOOSE to be criminals and I who CHOOSES not to be am punished for it because to punish them instead the liberals in this country would have to admit and understand that there are people who have no morals, who have no character, who have no respect who will do what they want when they want to do it. I have a warming for liberlas everywhere. There are alot more of me than there are of you. Back off. End of rant. GoodOlBoy
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(Moderator - Gear & Gadgets, Cowboy Action, SouthWest Regional, Small Game) GoodOlBoy@huntchat.com For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. - John 3:16 KJV Then I commended mirth, because a man hath no better thing under the sun, than to eat, and to drink, and to be merry: for that shall abide with him of his labour the days of his life, which God giveth him under the sun. - Ecclesiastes 8:15 KJV "The gun has been called the great equalizer, meaning that a small person with a gun is equal to a large person, but it is a great equalizer in another way, too. It insures that the people are the equal of their government whenever that government forgets that it is servant and not master of the governed." - 40th President of the United States Ronald Reagan 1911-2004
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#25
11-14-2006, 10:45 AM
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+1,000,000 GoodOlBoy!!!
Why is this so hard to understand for these people? I just don't get it. I'm beginning to think we really DO need to separate areas/sections of this country, in to Them, & Us. Sad days my friends.  Tall Shadow
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#26
11-14-2006, 10:57 AM
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GOB
Uhhh!!! Hey ...uuuhhhh GOB....why don't ya tell us how ya really feel??!! Right on bud. The points you make are the very things the socialists(PBR is not a socialist) and communists(he is closer to this) don't want people to have. They do want control of things..everything in fact. As someone stated.... in a PERFECT world communism would probably be the perfect government. Everyone would have the same things...make the same money ...have the same problems and so on. I personally would not want to live in that world....and I can certainly tell you wouldn't either. This is NOT a perfect world...and it will never be as long as people run it. Read Orwell's Animal Farm to see what I mean. It is a classic dissertation on an imperfect world.
Personal responsibility is what is lacking in the world now. No one wants to be responsible for their actions. Criminals can't be responsible...it was their (insert your favorite liberal excuse here). It seems the liberal media only want the conservative legislators or politicians to be responsible for what THEY(the media) perceive to be wrong. Bring a liberal politician to task for something?? Oh no....no need to in their estimation..... And like most of the liberal people in this country...when their ideas and programs are shown to be morally, ethically or politically bankrupt...PBR is cutting and running. But understand this...his type of liberals in this country want exactly what he says they don't...CONTROL over your and my and everyone's lives. Maybe he doesn't even realize it himself(hard to believe). But realize also, that the very same people who want this control over our lives also don't want the sheep in the flock to realize what is going on...until it is too late. Maybe he truly is a sheep...certainly his eyes and mind are closed to reality
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skeet@huntchat.com Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" Benjamin Franklin
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#27
11-14-2006, 11:03 AM
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Bravo GOB!!!
Well said, to say the least!! Nothing pisses me off more than people prying into my life. I go to buy a gun, a long gun, and they want my info. Ok, I can deal with that. Take my SSN and run me to see if I am a convicted felon. But thats it. It pisses me off that they need the type of weapon and serial number. They say they throw it out after the transaction. Yeah right!! Theres no list so they can come door to door when Pelosi gets her way to pick them up. If everyone had yours, and my, attitudes, GOB, the world would be a better place, no doubt. I think most folks on here agree. I dont want your social security, dont need you watching me every moment to protect me, dont need your help, dont need your welfare programs Uncle Sam, just let me be and Ill take care of me, mine and anyone else around me. I promise. Until I prove Im a bad person that cant be trusted, leave me the hell alone. PBR said another thing that really gets my goat. Protecting me from myself. Since when do I need protection from myself? Thats total BS. One of the laws that really torques me is seatbelts. I can see it for kids, some people just arent intelligent enough to take care of their kids, but I dont need that, thank you. No matter what excuse, it all boils down to insurance companies attornys. Thats the only reason for seatbelt laws. If I wanna crash my car and kill myself, whys that your business? As for socialism PBR, just be glad you live in a democracy, that should still be a republic, that allows you to say those things. If you want to live as a socialist, feel free to leave at any time and dont let the door hit you in the ass.
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#29
11-14-2006, 01:50 PM
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PBR makes no bones about his leanings toward socialism and gun control. It seems probable that he would point to England as a fine example and model for the U.S. to follow.
The British newspaper story from last week pasted below gives an excellent idea of how far things can go. I've checked out the source and the story is not a right-wing gun nut paranoid internet hoax. In fact, it would be difficult to make something like this up. I wonder if even PBR really wants things to go this far. It CAN happen here. http://www.guardian-series.co.uk/new...in_doorway.php Bullet found in doorway By David Williams LETHAL: The .22 calibre bullet found in Walthamstow High Street on a market day morning (D6W1001) LIVE ammunition has been found lying in the doorway of a busy high street shop. The .22 calibre short round bullet was found at the entrance of the 99p Stores in Walthamstow High Street on Wednesday morning, November 1. Haroon Khan, who has a firearms licence and is a member of a local gun club, was alarmed to discover live ammunition in a Walthamstow doorway. The bullet, of Swiss origin, was still in its brass casing, complete with enough gunpowder for it to fire itself. continued... Mr Khan said that if it had been struck hard enough or exposed to heat it could have gone off. "This sort of thing should not be lying around. It was live, primed and active," he said. "But rather me pick it up than a little kid. "How can you feel safe when you are finding things like this on the street? "To get hold of one of these is not easy. You have to go through a scrutinised search, you need a licence and you have to belong to a club." Ammunition of this kind would ordinarily be used in a small handgun or pistol, and both can be owned legally under licence. But to leave strictly controlled goods out in the street would be enough for a firearms licence to be revoked. The bullet has been examined at a Metropolitan Police laboratory and details about it kept for future reference. A police spokesman said: "Recovering firearms and ammunition is a priority for the police. We take the same view of ammunition as we do of a gun. "If it goes bang, it is still lethal." Police are treating the unattended ammunition as a crime. Mr Khan alerted them at 10.16am, and they arrived at his shop to pick up the bullet at 11.32am. 7:00pm Thursday 9th November 2006
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"The American military is like a finely crafted sword. To be effective, it must be wielded by a discerning, skilled and merciless hand."
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#30
11-14-2006, 02:26 PM
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Yes, England is a strange place these days. With the "Muslim Youth" trouble, The huge influx of illegal weapons, and their own socialists pushing for More!, More!, More! in the way of taxes, restrictions, and new laws for intrusions in to everyones lives..... I am glad I'm not British these days......
I try to show people how much Our own socialists are trying to make us like them. Many of the "sheep" just don't get it yet. Tall Shadow
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