no help for new hunters

[model8]

as hunting season draws near and new hunters kids and adults togeather it becomes a challenge to get started in the sport. my girl freind took her course here in ny and half the class where adults. though the classes are free everything else seems to be getting outragesly high priced and new hunters dnt seem to have the finances for the gear they need. for instance a used marlin 30-30 or 35 in decent shape is going for over 250 dollars a licence for just big game no muzzle loader is 30 dollars and decent knife will run another 30 to 50 dollars a coat is 100 to 400 dollars and boots from 30 to 300 dollars. all that gear u need is basic and money is tight now adays and it seems as if no one wants to help them kids and adults alike. when i was a kid i could buy a marlin 30-30 for 150 bucks. no one wants to lend a gun to a new hunter as my girlfreind had found out in the last few weeks. my question to everyone is when did the helping hand from other hunters get put in their pocket and what is your opinion on this situation now adays thanks and sorry so long wided good luck this year

[Mr. 16 gauge]

Just out of curiosity, when did you get into hunting?

no one wants to lend a gun to a new hunter as my girlfreind had found out in the last few weeks.

Things have changed, esp. in the last 10-15 years, and I would suspect that part of the problem is that of litigation: I loan you a gun, you load it with the wrong ammo and blow yourself up, and you sue me. Even if I 'win' in court, I loose because of the cost of hiring an attorney to represent me, lost time at work, ect.
Another reason could be the disrespect the younger generation tends to have now a days for people and things.....I've lent people firearms in the past, only to have them come back with a coating of rust. Irregardless of "well, I wouldn't do that", I wouldn't have lent it out if I thought the other person would, and the easiest solution to the problem is just not to loan it out at all.
I'll give you an actual case: A coworker of mine has season tickets to the Detroit tigers games. Another coworker had friends/family coming into town, and she made mention of possibly going to a baseball game. The first coworker gave her the tickets she needed for the game.....she wasn't going to use them, and didn't want them to go to waste. However, the second coworker never said so much as thanks, let alone said how the outing went, ect. I've tended to see the same behaviors in the younger generation as well.
As for buying gear: Do you think someone handed us everything we needed when we first got started? I sold greeting cards door to door, did odd jobs, babysat, ect to earn money to get my first shotgun.....and virtually everything else I bought hunting/fishing related. I did without a lot of other things in order to get that gear, like movies, dates, hamburgers, beer, ect. It's a question of wants vs needs.....if you need something, then you do without wants.
I will suggest that you check out you local salvation army and resale shops.....I've seen some great deals on boots, carharts, jackets and other clothing, some of which was never used. Even found a pair of camo waders (not my boot size, though)

[model8]

apearently i was misunderstood with the price of gear nothing and i mean nothing was handed to me as a kid i got what i earned and no more i didnt get a pair of wool pants til i was 20 and i had one wool coat and a gun that took me all summer to get 200 dollars for. what i meant by help is if u have extra coats u dnt use extar what ever gloves and the kid is and i repeat is trustworthy and willing to learn then i dnt see a reason why not hand down sum old stuff i do every year and did this year i gave away close to 300 dollars in gear i dnt use

[Adam Helmer]

model8,

I agree with Mr. 16 gauge on many of his points. I have not lent out a hunting arm since a bad experience in 1961. The legalese system of today is a better reason not to ever lend an arm to a newbie!

As for hunting gear, most folks have Winter clothes in their closet. The only NEW item needed is a $2.00 orange plastic vest available at Walmart and a $4 orange hat. As for knives, my $5 serated edge pocket knife has gutted many deer.

A hunting rifle will cost a newbie about one-fourth of a laptop computer or about the price of an Ipad, give or take. One sets one's priorities and goes accordingly.

Adam

[wrenchman]

I do feal your pain when i started Hunting most my fathers stuff would not fit or was wore out the most i can say is dont look down on yoused or cheeper brands you can still kill a deer with a rossi single shot in 243 as will as a 300 hundred dollars marlin rifel.
When i started bow hunting i read a book by chuck adems were he brought this up and said in many cases you have a plaid flanel shirt and it will brake up your pattern almost as well camo.
Lots of these newer products are geared to sell becouse they are the newest or the best if you paid me i would tell you cow poop made a great cover sent.
The thing is to remember dress for the weather have fun and be safe.
I have and do give away used or old equipment that is still good dont be scared to go to flee markets or yard sales a yoused coleman lamp is still good to day as it was 10 years ago and you can still get parts if it dont work.

[model8]

i see where u r comeing from i have got things from flee markets econd hand shops and yard sales my self but around here guys go around and buy it up even if they dnt need it and paying a high price for it as for the guns the price on guns has sky rocketed cause people are buying them like crazy around here and as for the newbie thing im talking about a person that has shot along time and has owned guns and gave guns to relatives for free and loaned them guns and now that she is in a rut they dnt wanna help her not just a freind or a cousin but fathers and brothers and grandfathers

[scalerman]

I hunted for 10 years with a gun that I hated in order to get the one I wanted. I know some very generous hunters but I don't know any that would loan a gun to a stranger. I have loaned guns to people that will be hunting under my direct supervision but never to someone I hardly know. Perhaps you should let your girlfriend carry your rifle while the two of you are out hunting- let her have first crack at it.

[model8]

yet again i repeat not a stranger she has asked her father who dsnt hunt any more her grand father her brothers 3 and i have no extras i gave her my extra muzzel loader and all of them she has bought guns for or given them guns she had as her own all but her grandfather she had 5 guns at one time and gave all but one away and last year sumone robbed her house and stole the gun so like i said she is not asking strangers

[Goody]

I hoed strawberries one summer to get the money for a 22. 50 years later i still have it. In the fall i picked apples so i could buy a shotgun. I loaned a rifle to what i thought was a friend. He said he would be back the next weekend with it. Didn't see him again for over a year. Never again. I bought my grandkids there first guns and gave one of them my wool hunting coat. If i needed a gun i know people that would lend me one.
bobg

[model8]

goody thats what im saying family should stick togeather good for u

[Rapier]

There is a major problem today with instant gratification, everything must be like the father's stuff or it is not good enough. My kids are just like that too.

When I started hunting, in HS, in NH. I had a pair of jeans a sweat shirt, no coat, a pair of old army boots, a cheap knife and a sportarized 7.7 Arisaka I bought for $7.50 without the stock, I later bought, a Fajen. About a year later I got a non insulated black and red plad thick wool zip up to go over the sweat shirt.

Why do you need a bunch of multiple of hundreds of dollar pieces and parts to learn how to hunt with? As a kid, I was happy as a pig in slop at 15 below, just to be out in the woods, hunting. My Dad did not hunt and as long as I had someone that would take me hunting I was good to go, rain, shine, cold or hot.

Now that does bring up another totaly different thing, by gosh, get off your collective rumps and take a kid hunting with you.

No Junior hunters = no more hunting, that is a fact.
Ed

[jplonghunter]

Rapier

Good advice!!!!!!!!!

jplonghunter

[fabsroman]

Originally Posted by model8

apearently i was misunderstood with the price of gear nothing and i mean nothing was handed to me as a kid i got what i earned and no more i didnt get a pair of wool pants til i was 20 and i had one wool coat and a gun that took me all summer to get 200 dollars for. what i meant by help is if u have extra coats u dnt use extar what ever gloves and the kid is and i repeat is trustworthy and willing to learn then i dnt see a reason why not hand down sum old stuff i do every year and did this year i gave away close to 300 dollars in gear i dnt use

I essentially froze my butt off to hunt until I graduated law school at the age of 28. At that time, I swore to myself that I would not spend another day freezing in a duck blind, on a deer stand, or while riding my bicycle during the winter. Since then, I have bought the best cold weather gear money can buy.

Prior to that, I worked as a courtest clerk when I was 16 so I could buy thermal tights and a jacket for cycling. It took 3 months of saving tips to be able to afford them. Bought my first gun with money earned working at a hot dog stand.

Now, I was introduced to hunting and shooting at a very early age by my dad. Thing is, it wasn't with a brand new gun. It was with a pellet gun and single shot .410 that were manufactured prior to World War II. We didn't have a lot of money while I was growing up, so we made due with what we could. That is why I spent many a day freezing my butt off.

As mentioned above, I wouldn't loan many of my guns to anybody. My brother just asked me to let him borrow my 20 gauge auto for this weekend so his girlfriend can shoot clays with him. I am hesitant about doing that since it is a wood stocked Beretta 391. I wouldn't mind too much about loaning him my backup hunting gun which is a synthetic stocked Beretta 3901, but it is a 12 gauge and would beat his girlfriend to death. I'm going to loan the 20 gauge to him regardless, even though he never returned the cutoff tool I loaned him 4 years ago, which required me to buy a new one when I finally needed it for a job.

Another story I have is that of a friend that borrowed a motorcycle from another friend and promised to pay for any damage to the bike. Well, the bike was totaled and the two guys found themselves in Court because the friend that borrowed it would not pay for it. I was representing the friend that borrowed the bike. He was coming up with every excuse possible not to pay for the bike (e.g., his friend should have had insurance on the bike, his friend had dead tags on the bike, his friend was riding a stolen bike last month, he would repair the bike himself). Ultimately, what he should have done is paid his friend the blue book value of the bike, taken the pieces, fixed it if he could, and sold it to recoup whatever he could. The fact that his friend had to take him to Court 2 years after the issue is BS.

Here is another story. I loaned a time trial helmet to a team mate of mine last year because I was sick and was not going to be able to attend the time trial. The helmet cost me $150. I asked for its return 3 times last year and once this year, and have yet to receive it. Mind you, this guy lives 2 miles away from me and we have ridden together on occassion. I have even offered to come by his place and pick the helmet up from him, but it doesn't seem like any time I propose is convenient for him. To think I thought about loaning him my $5,000 time trial bike.

I would rather loan somebody by beater car than one of my bikes or guns, with the exception of my beater mountain bike.

Now, if somebody is coming hunting or shooting with me, I will gladly loan them a gun. I did that on many an occassion as me and another hunting buddy in law school tried to introduce some of our classmates to hunting and shooting. I let my sisters shoot my 20 gauges when they come shooting with me. It makes me feel a lot better about it when I am present and the guns will be returning with me immediately. I said the same thing to my brother. I would have no hesitation about loaning him the 20 gauge if I was going shooting too, but since my wife works this weekend I am a little hesitant because I might never see the gun again.

We live in an age where respect and responsibility are not present in the majority of people.

[model8]

beleive me i have froze more than a few times in jeans and flanel pj pants with a torn old red plad coat my grandfather had that was way to big for me and a hat that could keep hot bread warm if it was still in the oven but what i did learn is that family is what keeps the young hunters hunting and memories are what make it special
i have been hunting now since i was 4 thats 23 years ago and i have more memories to last a life time new hunters dnt start when they get there license they start from children and sumone has to teach them the values of hunting respect and determination to suceed or whatss the use because with out help and guidance from us as hunters with years f experience there wnt be any hunters in the futre my respect goes to all of u that take a kid or even anyone who wants to learn hunting because that makes u sportsmen and to them it makes u a hero

[fabsroman]

Originally Posted by model8

beleive me i have froze more than a few times in jeans and flanel pj pants with a torn old red plad coat my grandfather had that was way to big for me and a hat that could keep hot bread warm if it was still in the oven but what i did learn is that family is what keeps the young hunters hunting and memories are what make it special
i have been hunting now since i was 4 thats 23 years ago and i have more memories to last a life time new hunters dnt start when they get there license they start from children and sumone has to teach them the values of hunting respect and determination to suceed or whatss the use because with out help and guidance from us as hunters with years f experience there wnt be any hunters in the futre my respect goes to all of u that take a kid or even anyone who wants to learn hunting because that makes u sportsmen and to them it makes u a hero

My kids are 3 and 1. I almost took them fishing/hunting last week but then work got in the way. They will both learn about hunting over the next couple of years.