Benelli M1 and Stoeger 2000

[losthwy]

According to an article I read in the lastest Field and Stream the Benelli M-1 and the Stoeger 2000 are almost exactly the same, with Benelli having better finish work . In fact the Stoegers have a better repair record than the M-1, but cost much less. I have since found out Benelli has licensed it's rotary system to Stoeger. For those who have used these shotguns what are your thoughts on which one to get????

[fabsroman]

If I am not mistaken, Benelli owns Stoeger and Franchi and Beretta owns them all, or at least a majority stock holder's interest in all of them. The rotating bolt on the Beretta Extrema is almost exactly like that of the Benelli SBE. So, I think there are a couple of shotguns out there that use the same tech as the Benellis.

I'd make a comparison here, but it would require me to equate the Benelli with Browning, and we know that Benelli is leaps ahead of Browning, and it would equate the Stoeger to the Winchester. The Browning has a couple more gizmos than the Winchester, but they are essentially the same gun.

[skeet]

Have a friend who brought me one to get fixed the other day. It was filled with grease and the cold broke the tip off the firing pin(mostly operator error..he should have cleaned the gun). Made a new pin on my lathe and hardened it somewhat with heat and a water and oil bath. He was shooting it yesterday at geese in the field(ahh the cell phone is great...sometimes). New factory pin is on the way. Fabs is right.. All owned by the same parent company...but the Stoeger is an almost exact copy of the Benelli at half the cost. Think they are made in Turkey...but they make some pretty good guns over there. I heard from a factory rep bout a year ago that they have prayer rooms in the factories for the Muslim workers. Wow.. Unique idea, huh? Anyway..if ya want a 3" gun buy the Stoeger...if 3 1/2" buy a Mossberg 935. Pretty good buys if you want to save a good bit of money. If you want to be upscale like Fabs...well he has a SBE he might sell ya. But remember...he's an attorney...hehehehe sorry Fabs but I had to say it

Hey Lost...he's an ok guy. I've hunted with him!!

[fabsroman]

Lost,

This is my philosophy on guns, cars, and homes. I buy the nicest gun and car for the job, but I don't over indulge on it. If it is a working gun, I don't get the guns with the scroll work on them, but I buy what I think is the best one out there for the job. Same goes for my daily commuter car. I buy a decent car with all the upgrades in it, but I don't go out and buy a Lexus or Mercedes. I drive a plain old Ford Taurus every day. Now, the truck is a F-350 Lariat Crew Cab and that is my toy. Same goes for the 1989 Mustang that I have. The current house is a 7 year old townhouse that I bought 6 months ago and that I am completely remodeling. The fiance and I intend on staying here for about 7 years so I am making it as nice to live in as possible. Hopefully, in 7 years we will be in a position to have a new single family house built on a couple of acres of property. Since we will probably be living in that house the rest of our lives, or until we go to a nursing home, I intend on making it as nice as possible. The next vehicle purchase will be a Ford Expedition or Ford Five Hundred in the Eddie Bauer or SLS trims respectively. My dream clays gun is a Beretta DT-10, but my dream shotgun is a Beretta 682EELL or the new Beretta 682EL with the gold game scenes. Those would be bought just to sit in the safe. I have also seen a couple of really nice older Berettas, I think they were Jubilees with game scenes engraved on them. That is another dream gun that would sit in the safe for the most part.

What I am trying to say is that I tend to keep and use my guns, cars, and homes for a while, so I tend to spend the extra couple of dollars on them but I don't do insane stuff like hunt waterfowl with a Beretta 682 Gold E or my Beretta 391 Teknys sporting clays gun. Hunting guns are my Beretta 686 Onyx, my Beretta 3901, and my Benelli SBE. I have yet to sell a gun I bought and I have yet to buy a used gun. Same goes for cars. I have yet to buy a used car and I have yet to sell or trade in a car. When I am done with a car, it is usually done and ready for the junk yard. Currently, I have three dream cars. The 2005 Ford Mustang Cobra, the 1968 Ford Mustang Boss with a 428 in it, and a Ferrari (the exact Ferrari is unknown right now, but I would settle for a 355).

I guess you also have to look at how much you value the thing you are going to buy. Will you be using it a lot, or just a little? I buy some really nice tools if I know I will be using them quite often, but if it is something that I will only use once in a blue moon, I tend to settle for the middle of the line. I use my commuting car, guns, and house a lot, so they are what is important for me. I applied the same principal when buying my dog, but I don't use him, he uses me. Just haven't had the time to take him out hunting as much as I should have this year.

Bottom line, I probably wouldn't buy a Stoeger as my main hunting gun because it isn't made in Italy like Benelli and even though both companies are owned by Beretta, it doesn't mean that both companies are run in the same manner (e.g., quality controls might be a little more off at Stoeger). A buddy of mine bought one of those Stoeger o/u's before they were owned by Beretta and the thing shot a couple of feet high at 40 yards. That might have been good if it was a trap gun, but it was a field gun. Now, if all my hunting years were as slim as this year, the Stoeger would be my gun of choice because I wouldn't be able to justify spending the money on a Benelli to only hunt 5 times a year. Over the last 8 years, for the most part, I have killed 100+ doves, 50+ ducks, and 100+ geese a season. This year, I have 52 doves, 0 geese, and 0 ducks. This is probably my worst season ever, and I mean since I was about 12 years old.

If you are going to use the gun for hunting and don't care about the finish and will not be hunting that much, buy the Stoeger. If you get all your hunting guns in synthetic like me, then finish really doesn't matter, and the only thing that matters is functionality/reliability.


I left off that Skeet is also an okay guy, even for a retired guy.

As an aside, I now see why people hate attorneys. I have a hispanic speaking client that paid for an attorney to represent his cousin in a first degree assault charge. At the end of the day, the cousin wasn't happy with the representation, so he wanted to hire another attorney. The new attorney had my client sign a document, that the new attorney said was a release of the previous attorney from the case, but which turns out to be an attorney-client agreement wherein my client was to pay $10,000 for the representation of his cousin. My client never paid a dollar of the $10,000, but the cousin paid $7,000 of it until he ended up in jail for 4 months. After that, he stopped paying. Well, this guy is now suing my client and in reviewing the document it is so poorly drafted that even I, an attorney, cannot understand exactly what the other attorney was trying to convey with this document. He should have had my client sign a third party payment agreement advising my client that his actual client was the cousin and then crafted his attorney client agreement with the cousin to make the cousin ultimately responsible for the bill, make the cousin aware of the third party payment arrangement, and make the cousin understand that the cousin was in charge of the litigation. This should be a fun one in court, and to think that this guy makes $10,000 for something like this, he has been practicing 16 years, he probably didn't put much work into the case, and he isn't a big name attorney. I spent an entire night tossing and turning over this, and would like to knock this guy upside the head. His kid's tuition was probably coming due so he needed to find the money somewhere. Like I have told many people, I have no idea how some of the people in law school with me ever passed the bar exam, much less how they continue to acquire clients.

[skeet]

Fabs has some good ideas here. I certainly agree with him on most of the ideas. When it comes to a lot of things in the outdoors...buy the best you can afford. especially when it comes to cold weather clothing..decoys & gear for safety. You'll never go wrong. When it comes to guns for field use just buy what you are comfortable with. Make sure it fits and if the model of gun has been around for a while...well it'll probably work just fine. Doesn't matter what it is. If it is a problem gun it won't last on the market long. Remington is finding that out now with the 11-87 3 1/2" semi auto. We all have out likes and dislikes so buy what you are happy with. He is also correct about nice expensive guns. You really do get what you pay for. I shoot a Krieghoff K-80 O/U for Skeet. Replacement cost on the gun is 8,000 for the basic gun..9,000 for the engraving, 7,000 for the stock...plus another 2,000 or so for the other accoutrements. Now understand I only paid a fraction of that when I bought the gun in the early 90's. I have spent exactly 275 bucks on maintenance since I've owned it. It has been shot approximately 275-300 thousand times.. yep you read that right. It gets cleaned sporadically and I have only had one parts breakage in all that time and the gun continued to work...in fact I won a State Skeet Championship with it broken. Quality really does count. In the course of guiding and shooting quite a few geese over the years...I used for the most part 3 guns.. Until the need to go to steel shot I used a model 12 Winchester and a Browning Auto 5(gag). After the advent of steel I used an 1100 or 11-87. Fairly cheap guns...but they almost always worked. Use what works for you and use what you really like.

As far as Fabs....I am afraid the hunting fields are going to be missing him what with all the work and the townhouse and the soon to be wife. It is a sad loss too. I was hoping to get him to take me huntin for those ol resident geese on the western shore of Maryland....yessiree bob...a sad loss indeed!! I remember doing the same thing myself..... lo these many years. Course now days momma's the only one workin so I just have to hunt a lot to get the larder filled with meat ...ya understand, I hope!

[fabsroman]

Well, I have a doozey of a cold now, but I am planning on going goose hunting towards the end of the week as it warms up a little. Hopefully, those plans will stay intact.