#4 buck & #5 shot

[model 70]

is there a huge difference between these two in say a 2 3/4" 12ga. shell? going pheasant hunting and am likely to bump a coyote or two and probably spot some raccoons in the river bottoms i'll be hunting pheasant in. thanks.

[skeet]

4 Buck measures approx 24 caliber...Quite large...#5 shot is .12...a whole lot smaller...a good size for pheasants etc...The 4 buck will work fine on Coyotes...if they are pretty close.. I've never seen a coon while hunting...especially during the day..unless they were sick.. nocturnal for the most part don't ya know. If you do run up on one just shoot it with the #5's don't use 4 buck on Pheasants..

[fabsroman]

Good lord, I don't think you need #4 buckshot for anything on this hunting trip. If you jump a coyote up close, which I highly doubt because they aren't stupid enough to wait around for you, you can kill it with #5 shot.

Regarding the raccoons, Skeet is entirely right. They are rarely seen during the day unless they are sick. I have only seen one during the day while I was out in the woods. It was winter time and we were hand throwing clays. We saw him about 50 yards away, closed the gap to about 30, and let him have it with #7.5 and #8. He didn't even notice us while we walked toward him, or he just didn't really care. Raccoons seen during the day should be shot because it is highly likely that they will be carrying rabies or something else.

I would never shoot a pheasant with #4 buckshot unless you do not intend on eating it. Plus, the pattern gets rather sparse further out there.

Trying to change from #5 shot to #4 buckshot should you encounter a coyote would be a pain in the rear.

My advice, if you are going pheasant hunting, go pheasant hunting and take any other opportunities presented as they are presented. I have jumped plenty of deer in cornfields while upland hunting or dove hunting, but I don't shoot at them with a shotshell. If the coyote is close enough, kill it. If not, so be it.

I have even tried the good old changing of shells in the duck/goose blind and it is a pain in the rear even when I can see the geese coming in from 100's of yards out. I keep the first two shells in gun for ducks and make the third a goose round/far range duck round. When I see the geese in the air, I change up the first two shells. If you have done any waterfowling, you know that you can get caught with your pants down sometimes from low flying birds, and that is when it gets really interesting because I am usually the only guy calling.

I left the blind once to scare some geese and ducks out of an adjoining field and left my dad in the blind in case anything flew that way. He was loaded with goose shells and when everything got up, 6 ducks landed in our decoys. I sat there scratching my head because he didn't shoot and the ducks flew off after being in the decoys for half a minute. His account, he didn't see them at first, but the dog started acting crazy. Then, he saw the ducks in the decoys and tried to switch from #BB to #2 steel. The ducks heard or saw his movement and took off. He would have been better off just shooting at them with BB's. Lesson learned.

[model 70]

my shotgun is a single shot, beark action. i normally carry a couple rounds of #4 buck while squirrel hunting, just in case i happen upon something a bit bigger like a coyote.

[fabsroman]

Everything I shoot can change the first shell just as easily as you can change that single shell.

My Benelli and Beretta autos do not feed the second shell when the bolt is pulled back, so I could just drop a different load in there without too much hassle, but that little bit of hassle is just enough. Same goes for the o/u's I shoot.

In the 2 to 3 seconds it takes to reach into your pocket and swap the shell out of the gun, that coyote will be long gone if you spooked him. Have you ever jumped a coyote while walking around squirrel hunting and tried to change shells?

I believe it can be done if you are hunting out of a blind or something (i.e., standing still), but pheasant hunting involves a lot of walking in the open. Jumping a coyote in range isn't very probable when you are doing pheasant hunting. Unless of course he is hiding somewhere thinking that you will pass him by and he breaks under the pressure. I would be very surprised if you got the jump on a coyote and even more surprised if you jumped one, swapped shells in time to get a shot off, and ended up with a kill.

If this is your first pheasant hunt, I think you should concentrate on the pheasants and make it as good a pheasant hunt as possible. After you are comfortable with pheasant hunting, then try shooting at coyotes by swapping out shells.

Then again, take the buckshot with you and see how many coyotes you jump. Doesn't hurt to lug it around.

This situation reminds me of a waterfowl hunt I went on last year in November. I was hunting in a cut corn field and dove season had just opened back up. The doves were flying like crazy and I hadn't seen a single goose. So, I decided to get out of the blind, move about 100 yards away, and start shooting doves. I took the dog with me too. Wouldn't you know it, as I am shooting away at the doves, here comes a ton of geese at 10:00. I didn't have the chance to make it to the blind because they caught me with my pants down. I was hoping for a passing shot at that point. They came right by the decoys, lost some altitude, sqwaucking like crazy, but they just didn't come close enough. They circled a couple of times and that was it. Then group after group followed them onto a different field. I was cussing up a storm after that, but somehow I manage to do something like that every year. At least I killed my limit of doves that day.

[model 70]

exactly! expect the unexpected but don't expect much.

[Jack]

I've never run across raccoons while upland bird hunting, but I 've had several come in to a turkey call during spring turkey.
I use #5 shot turkey loads, they work fine on coons- don't see the need for buckshot there.....

[model 70]

can you use #5 turkey loads on pheasant? what's the difference?

[fabsroman]

#5 turkey loads are a tad much. Try firing a turkey load out of that single shot and see if you have any fillings left. Bottom line is that you can use a howitzer on pheasants, but it is not necessary.

My brother was using 3 1/2" turkey loads in #6 for doves the first year he got his SBE and was wondering why he had a migrane at the end of the day. In your gun, you can only probably shoot 3" shells, so that should merely leave you with whiplash and a headache.

I am willing to bet that the recoil from a 3" turkey load is probably a good amount more than the recoil from your .270. I could be wrong, but I would be willing to put money on it.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what you are shooting at that pheasant if you are not on the mark. My brother learned that with the 3 1/2" turkey loads for doves. Plus, for him it was really tough to get back on the dove with the second and third shots.

[tjwatty]

My second year of turkey hunting I/we killed a coyote that was trying to sneak up on our decoys. I shot him with leftover #5 pheasant loads at about 25 yards. My shot did not drop him in his tracks but it sure flipped him ******* over elbows. As he was leaving my partner hit him with 10ga. #5 turkey load and he made it about another 50yds before kicking over. I would be willing to bet that 50yrds would have been it even without the 10ga. assistance.
My first ever coyote was killed at 15 to 20yds with 7 1/2 birds loads. My brittanny was in hot pursuit and the old coyote never new I was there. Hit him head on with my skeet barrel on a 1100 Remington, he ran about 20 yds. Hit one about a week later in the butt, didn't kill him but he sure ran a lot faster after the shot. Looked like Wile E. Coyote on the roadrunner. ZOOOOOOMMMMM

[Jack]

Fabs, you are so right about the recoil of turkey loads.
Good number of years ago, when I first got my Mossberg 500 turkey gun, I did some pattern testing. And I certainly noticed the recoil.
When I got back from the range at the end of my patterning session, I consulted a chart and calculated the recoil my 2 ounce payload 12 gauge 3" turkey loads were producing..... the answer was, equivalent to a 375 H&H firing 300 grain bullets from an 8 pound rifle.

[fabsroman]

Jack,

I touched off a 3 1/2" 2 1/4 oz turkey load one winter in my 7 lb SBE and couldn't feel my shooting hand for about 10 minutes. Never had that problem with any rifle of mine.

As far as bird shot on game goes, I have killed several groundhogs withg #7.5 trying to make it to their holes a couple of yeas ago and I was using a 20 ga. on those occassions.

[Jack]

Fabs, haven't tried the 7 1/2 field load on woodchucks
The #5 turkey load is very effective on them, I can say that.
I have absolutely no desire to fire a 7 pound gun with 3 1/2 turkey loads in it. The 3 inch in a light gun is bad enough.