CWD - fostered by greed and profit

fabsroman · #1 03-20-2006, 09:28 PM

SIXTY FARM DEER TEST POSITIVE FOR CWD . . . Sixty of 76 deer killed at a Wisconsin game farm earlier this year tested positive for chronic wasting disease (CWD), reports The Capital Times. The U.S. Department of Agriculture had taken the deer at the Portage County farm on Jan. 17, after reaching an agreement with its owner. The state had wanted to eradicate the herd since the disease was discovered there in 2002, but the owner fought the case in court. The state believes the disease spread through the herd so extensively because of the 3 1/2-year court battle, the Associated Press reports.

Cut and pasted from NSSF Bullet Points newsletter.

This stuff burns me up.

gumpokc · #2 03-20-2006, 09:36 PM

Yup, herd should have been destroyed.

Yes the owner would have lost out on quite abit of change, but it isn't like having a herd of CWD deer is going to make him any money anyways.

skeeter@ccia.com · #3 03-21-2006, 10:28 AM

My local butcher shop/ smokehouse all went to school for government inspection to comply with regs and keep up on things like CWD and their shops. Stated to me is never eat the organs from deer and never leave the bone in such as with a steak etc. This is where the CWD thrives. I did no study on this matter myself but this is what they learned from the government inspectors. I agree the heard should be taken care of so the spread is contained. I think all the messing with mother nature for profit etc has caused lots of issues and diseases. Even in humans.. I wonder if the so called overweight problems they say we americans have isn't caused by the steroids added to livestock food? I'm sure as we eat the meat, we injest it. I am still a believer fresh meat such as deer is way better for us than the pen raised / fed steer. But on the other hand, the angus stake on the grill yesterday was great...... another notch in the belt?..
I also think Pa should lift the friday,saturday,sunday hunting of crows to any day of the week....can leave the nesting season alone but crows can carry the bird flu and other things so why not let us keep the flocks under control?...

fabsroman · #4 03-21-2006, 02:49 PM

Regarding the shooting of crows on days other than Wednesday through Saturday, I have heard that it is because of an agreement with Mexico that states that crows can only be hunted on those days. Seems as though Mexico had a rare crow that it wanted to protect by limiting crow hunting to a certain number of days.

I would like to see crow hunting throughout the week. Personally, I don't think enough people shoot them and that is why we have so many. Around here, in the winter you can see them flying from roost to feeding area in the morning by the thousands and you see the same thing in the evening, but in the reverse direction. A friend and I once found a farm to hunt on in between that route, and we killed quite a crow there. Our max morning being 42 before we had to get to class.

Aim to maim · #5 03-21-2006, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fabsroman
[B A friend and I once found a farm to hunt on in between that route, and we killed quite a crow there. Our max morning being 42 before we had to get to class. [/B]

Gives an entirely different meaning to the phrase "a murder of crows".

(Obscure inside joke for those who have an interest in collective nouns)

multibeard · #6 03-21-2006, 07:08 PM

We have two 60 day crow seasons here. Feb and March -----August and Sept. Shoot any day you want. If you can hunt year around you have us beat. I would love to hunt them any day in June when the juvies are so dumb.

That is unless they are about to do damage. I have lots of farms that I can hunt all summer so we can shoot them dumb young crows.

An old dutch farmer outside of Holland Michigan told us one time that the crows would set in the fence lines and watch for a hen to move on her nest. They would then drive her off the nest and eat the eggs.

I have a sweet cherry farmer that supplies the amo to shoot crows and starlings out of his fruit and sweet corn. The worst thing is it is robins that were doing most of the damage to the cherries The robin is Michigan's state bird.

fabsroman · #7 03-21-2006, 10:39 PM

We get to hunt crows from August 15 to March 15, from Wednesday through Saturday with no breaks in the season and no limit on the number we can kill. I usually shoot them in August as a warm up for dove and early resident goose season, but this year early resident goose season comes in on August 1, so I'll be "warming up" on geese this year in shorts.

gumpokc · #8 03-21-2006, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Aim to maim
Gives an entirely different meaning to the phrase "a murder of crows".

(Obscure inside joke for those who have an interest in collective nouns)

chuckle

i always wondered why they called a flock of crows a murder, guess i know now

fabsroman · #9 03-22-2006, 12:09 AM

I learn something new every day. Today, I learned that group of crows is called a "murder" and a group of ravens is called an "unkindness". Utterly insane. How about we just call things a group. For instance a group of deer instead of a herd of deer. A group of crows instead of a murder of crows. A group of birds instead of a flock. A group of geese instead of a gaggle. A group of lions instead of a pride. Man, that would save a few pages in Websters.

skeeter@ccia.com · #10 03-22-2006, 07:28 AM

Pa crows july1-nov27 and dec30-april2..friday,sat,sunday only..and is a 'blast' but do you think since they do migrate and are in great numbers they could bring in the fird flu? Probably get here soon one way or another and probably carried in with the storms of the summer that cross the oceans but I think more days to hunt crows a week would help out the situation....as mentioned to the PGC.
I can't say as I ever seen a dumb crow yet. As they sit on the roost wondering what all the noise is about down in the field, they send in the less liked one of them all...old joe....to see what is going on....then when joe don't come back, you can hear them argue up there...one says..bet he found something good to eat and is hoggin it down.....so the young ones can't stand it anymore so they fly down too....that is when the fun starts....right fabs?....I lost one of the best spots for this a few years ago when the farmers bull killed him in the stall...now his wife don't want anyone messing with her babies....even doves...may they all flock in the tree above her new car.

fabsroman · #11 03-22-2006, 04:48 PM

I hear your pain about losing that farm.

You hit it pretty much on the hand with the way crows react. The best is when you wound a couple and they start calling back to the ones in the air. That is when it really gets fun.

Aim to maim · #12 03-22-2006, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fabsroman
I learn something new every day. Today, I learned that group of crows is called a "murder" and a group of ravens is called an "unkindness". Utterly insane. How about we just call things a group. For instance a group of deer instead of a herd of deer. A group of crows instead of a murder of crows. A group of birds instead of a flock. A group of geese instead of a gaggle. A group of lions instead of a pride. Man, that would save a few pages in Websters.

Yeah, but it would be far less fun. Speaking of insane, an "insanity" refers to a group of March Hares. (I admit I made that one up. I also have one for a group of jackrabbits but it's not appropriate for this forum.)

On a related note, it's disconcerting to see an attorney call for a simplicfication of language. Perhaps the end times are at hand. Hmm, I wonder how many pages in Black's Law Dicitonary could be saved.

Skyline · #13 03-22-2006, 07:29 PM

Pretty radical change from the original topic.

Am I to assume that anyone who raises game animals, such as deer or elk, which was obviously OK'd in the first place by the respective state fish and game departments or state agriculture departments.........is only involved in that industry because of profits and greed??

That is a very simplistic and rather misinformed view of this issue.

Is the dairy farmer in Wisconsin that raises holstein milk cows, who suddenly has a few animals test positive for bovine TB, also in the "fostered by greed and profit" category?

Set aside your views regarding 'fenced hunting' for a moment and ask yourself that question. The various states and provinces allowed this in the first place. In many instances they encouraged farmers to get into 'diversified livestock' and encouraged lending institutions to loan them the money needed to build the fencing, handling facilities and to purchase bredding stock .......then when problems occur they wash their hands of these producers.

I personally detest 'canned hunting' for farm raised elk and deer, but I also detest the way most states and provinces have left the producers with game animals hanging out to dry.

No one would be in this situation if the game and fish departments and agriculture departments had done their homework before they approved the practice and started issuing the licences/permits.

fabsroman · #14 03-22-2006, 11:28 PM

"The state believes the disease spread through the herd so extensively because of the 3 1/2-year court battle, the Associated Press reports."

That is the part that bothers me. Obviously, the guy did not want them to take his herd at the beginning when they found the disease. So, he battled it in Court, let the disease spread, and ran the risk of the disease getting out to wild animals. The question is why? I am assuming that it was because of greed and profit. I doubt the State was willing to pay the guy for his deer, and definitely wouldn't be willing to pay the deer the "trophy" price for the deer. On the flip side, what happens if a person, hunting on this ranch, comes down with CWD after eating venison from one of the deer killed on this ranch? Should this rancher have thought about that? How much money would that hunter and his/her loved ones (e.g., spouse, sons, daughters) be entitled to from this rancher?

I don't know much about the Court case, but I am willing to bet it was over greed.

As far as simplifying things, I am all for it, but I don't think society is. Society continues to make things new and improved, like the short magnum rifle cartridges, the 3 1/2" 12 gauge, and Hevi-Shot which is denser than lead but 5 times more expensive.

I find that a lot of my clients do not know all the sophistication that goes with the law, so I try to simplify things as much as possible. One client wasn't read his rights so he thought he was off the hook on a DUI. Try explaining to him that the lack of being read his rights only means that a confession cannot be used againt him, and that he was read his right to refuse the breathalyzer, but agreed to it and it could be used against him. My life is anything but simple.

popplecop · #15 03-23-2006, 08:21 AM

Part of the CWD problem is the horn mania we have now. I was born and raised in a county were the main industry was either railroad or pulp. In those years we had buck only hunting from the ground an no bait. We actually shot some bucks that way. To get a buck was great no one worried about inside, tine lenght measurements, one did ask how many points though. Times change deer everywhere, now we want huge racks, let's improve antler growth in our own little world, import a live buck with the right genes and release in our hunting area. No it was not inspected, no reliable test for CWD on live deer. May have been another way it started here. As far as shooting deer on deer farms for horns, wow there's some bragging rights for you. Try and clamp down on my deer farm, I'll see you in court, that is good for at least a 3 year delay. If I sound a little bitter, I am. We have several generations that here that couldn't shoot a deer if it wasn't for bait piles. Some say senior citizens and handicap need bait, maybe so. I'm in my late 60s, have an artificial hip and knee in on leg and a brace on the other. If I can't hunt deer way a woodsman would time to find a new sport. Now I'm off my soap box, just an old mans opinon.